# Rabies. Why I might never get them immunized again.



## jesuschick (Dec 5, 2010)

Things did not have to get critical for me to reconsider my plans.

We took all 3 girls for part 2 of their 3 year Rabies (I know this is not applicable to many of you outside of the U.S.). As always, I lightly dosed each with Children's Benadryl the evening before and then the morning of their injections. They all did fine at the visit. Later that afternoon Eden just did not seem like herself. She is my velcro dog so is constantly with me. She was shaking her head. I noticed that the insides of her ears were very red (it was very visible against her ears which are black on the outside and white inside) and then noticed that one ear was very swollen. I dosed (as I always do when immunized) that evening and the next morning and we hung around home with them the remainder of the weekend so we could closely watch them. 
I called the Vet and told them details for her record. I told the woman that I spoke with that I will want titers for her or I want an exemption for her. Had I not been dosing her with Benadryl, I would imagine her whole face could have swelled. The more I think of it, I am likely to not have any of them immunized for Rabies again. I will titer or simply be non-compliant with the law. I guarantee with the size of Chis, with titers I will see them covered for YEARS to come. 

Anyone else seek an exemption, titer for Rabies or opt out of the immunizations?


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## Onyx (Nov 28, 2011)

Aw I'm sorry you had to deal with that, hope little Eden is doing better now.

I myself, never vaccinate my dog anymore, for any vaccination. I live in California where it's the law to get rabies, can't even get an exemption. But you know what?? I don't give a damn LOL. Onyx has gotten two rabies shots, one when she was a puppy and one when she was 1 year. After I read up on the risks, I just didn't feel revaccinating her was worth it.

She is now 6 years old and still no vaccinations. Because she's not registered with the city, I don't get hassled about shots. I also have an awesome vet who doesn't require your pets to have regular shots or an exam to be seen. I honestly feel most comfortable breaking this law than I do vaccinating my pets for something that lasts years. Especially when I own small dogs


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## KrystalLeigh (Aug 17, 2011)

Wow Karen, that's scary. Good thing the reaction was not more serious. Odie is due for shots now (not sure exactly which ones) and we're planning on asking for titers, including rabies. It's not the law here that you have to vaccinate against rabies, but even if it was as long as my dog was immune, I wouldn't do it. Just curious, how do they regulate that law?


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## Lindsayj (Apr 18, 2012)

I'm interested in this as well. I want to know what happens if you don't vaccinate since it is the law. Does anyone really check this? What happens if you are caught? Is it just a fine? If it's just a fine, then I wouldn't care. I wouldn't want them to take my dog away or something like that though. I know if they bite someone then it can be a problem though.

I'm so glad that Eden is ok. I'm sure that was very scary. Thank God you pre-dosed with Benadryl!


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## teetee (Aug 25, 2011)

I didn't vaccinate in the states. The only time I ran in to trouble was during vet visits. They'd harass me to get them vaccinated, and refuse care if I didn't...


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## Lindsayj (Apr 18, 2012)

teetee said:


> I didn't vaccinate in the states. The only time I ran in to trouble was during vet visits. They'd harass me to get them vaccinated, and refuse care if I didn't...


Did you just have to switch vets a lot?


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## teetee (Aug 25, 2011)

I didn't vaccinate until I was forced to. This was before I had dogs, so it was with Taji. Also, it was before I knew about tittering. Oddly, the vets never suggested tittering either. No we didn't switch vets, we just got the shot. 

Miya and Taji are up for their rabies now. Here in Japan it is a law. Titering doesn't exists, so I was told. In order to get them back to the states when we move home, they will have to have the rabies vaccine


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## Lindsayj (Apr 18, 2012)

teetee said:


> This was before I had dogs, so it was with Taji. Also, it was before I knew about tittering. Oddly, the vets never suggested tittering either. No we didn't switch vets, we just got the shot.
> 
> Miya and Taji are up for their rabies now. Here in Japan it is a law. Titering doesn't exists, so I was told. In order to get them back to the states when we move home, they will have to have the rabies vaccine


Yeah, I'm definitely titering next time for both of mine. I know Ella got her shots because we decided to get them when we got her since she didn't come from a good background and the previous owner couldn't "remember" when she got her shots. Chloe has had her puppy shots and then when she was a year old. My only hesitation about not doing the rabies is that they aren't allowed in places if they don't have it. They can't even go to the groomers to the their nails cut. No training classes or anything. Obviously health is more important, but it's definitely an inconvenience. Especially since Chloe absolutely will not let me cut her nails. She acts like we're killing her. But she's a perfect angel at the groomers. Smh.


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## Zorana1125 (Oct 24, 2010)

Hi Karen! I am so sorry to hear about Eden's experience. I have yet to vaccinate mimi w rabies, I know I need to in order for her to be spayed. I always freak out when it comes to vaccines, I had to look around for a while before finding a vet who had single valent and bivalent vaccines vs the 5in1 and 7in1. 

Lola was due for her rabies booster this past summer and I didn't want to do it. I asked my vet to titer her (which is crazy $$$) and her responce was titers won't hold up in court so they r useless. My dilemma was lola needed a dental and they need to be utd on shots, since my vets has known lola since she was 6 months old, she let mr skip it. 

I am happy to hear eden is ok and that the reaction wasn't nearly as bad as it could have been. 

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## teetee (Aug 25, 2011)

Lindsayj said:


> . She acts like we're killing her. But she's a perfect angel at the groomers. Smh.



LOL, so funny!! I tried to give Domo a haircut a few weeks ago. You would have thought I had him tied down and was torturing him. My friend was here and she said to let her try and he just sat there and FELL ASLEEP while she was cutting his hair. WTH? lol

Do they groomers/hotels/other places accept tittering proof?


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## teetee (Aug 25, 2011)

Other than having an allergic reaction to vaccines, why don't you all want to have them done? Better yet, why do the vets push for them to be done knowing it can cause health issues?


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## Lindsayj (Apr 18, 2012)

teetee said:


> LOL, so funny!! I tried to give Domo a haircut a few weeks ago. You would have thought I had him tied down and was torturing him. My friend was here and she said to let her try and he just sat there and FELL ASLEEP while she was cutting his hair. WTH? lol
> 
> Do they groomers/hotels/other places accept tittering proof?


I don't know. But I doubt it since it's a dumb law. I know our dog park doesn't accept titering.


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## Lindsayj (Apr 18, 2012)

teetee said:


> Other than having an allergic reaction to vaccines, why don't you all want to have them done? Better yet, why do the vets push for them to be done knowing it can cause health issues?


I'm sure Zorana can explain better, but dogs can have other problems from over vaccinating. I know that Zorana's dog Gino? (Was that his name? I'm sorry I can't remember) actually died from over vaccinating before she knew better. I'm sure she will come on here and tell what happened to him. It was just awful.


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## teetee (Aug 25, 2011)

Annual rabies vaccines can be considered "over vaccinating"? I can see how getting the distempers and those kinds annually, but rabies too? That is so sad about her dog. 

We had a dog park in VA that required paperwork to go in to. I never registered and just played dumb when asked. haha


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## Zorana1125 (Oct 24, 2010)

teetee said:


> Other than having an allergic reaction to vaccines, why don't you all want to have them done? Better yet, why do the vets push for them to be done knowing it can cause health issues?


The vets push for them bc they think if u don't schedule annual vaccinations, u won't come in for an appt. I think the vet guidelines have changed a while ago saying every 3 years is now the recommendation. But few vets follow this. In a perfect science, once they get their puppy sets, they should be immune for life but that's not always the case. For example, lola has her pup shots then when her 1 year booster was due, we titered and came back with strong titers. 3 years later she was due for a booster and we titered. Her parvo was great but her distemper had no antibodies left so we have her just the distemper shot with nothing else. We will titer again in 3 years. 

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## debrawade10 (Oct 10, 2013)

My two Mexican Frenchies are eight and a half pounds. Both had a horrible reaction to their vaccinations this year, it was their 2 yr. old shots. Within 2-3 hours they were lethargic, about an hour later they were basically immobile. They were so sore everywhere that they were crying, I couldn't pick them up without them screaming.
Needless to say I rushed them back, they were given Benedryl, pain control, I had to watch them closely. Luckily they were fine the next day!
My vet says they will be titered from now on.
I had never experienced this before with any of my dogs, it was very scary to see. She will be titering Lily also.


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## Onyx (Nov 28, 2011)

teetee said:


> Annual rabies vaccines can be considered "over vaccinating"? I can see how getting the distempers and those kinds annually, but rabies too? That is so sad about her dog.


Oh Yes! Someone on here actually posted an article stating that the rabies vaccine lasts about 7 years! The problem? The makers of these vaccines aren't the ones who tested and discovered this, therefor by label they won't state it. The only way to get the manufacturers to say "yes, it lasts 7 years" is for them to do the tests themselves. Which why would they when that would equal less vaccines, which equals less money.

The main problem for me is, you have no idea if your dog will react to a vaccine until it's too late. Chancing that yearly is just ridiculous and the law needs to be changed. Rabies has also been known to cause cancer at the injection location. Not to mention over vaccinating weakens the immune system.

Here in California, they were trying to get a law passed to at least allow dogs who have had a reaction to pass on annual rabies. Not sure if the law has passed, but even if so, your dog has to first have a reaction before they allow your dog to skip rabies  which that's of course if the dog lives.

I'm not trying to convince anyway to go against your local laws!! So please don't take my post that way. Everyone should do what they are comfortable with doing. The point of my post was more that they should really change this ignorant law. Especially since rabies is not an overly common thing here.


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## Zorana1125 (Oct 24, 2010)

Lindsayj said:


> I'm sure Zorana can explain better, but dogs can have other problems from over vaccinating. I know that Zorana's dog Gino? (Was that his name? I'm sorry I can't remember) actually died from over vaccinating before she knew better. I'm sure she will come on here and tell what happened to him. It was just awful.


Yup that was his name. He taught me everything I know today. He ended up w autoimmune disease a few months after his 1 year booster and rabies. It was a very long and expensive 6 months, but I did learn a lot. The constant fevers, lesions/bumps on his head, stiff joints and limping, heart mumur, lesion on his bladder wall and inability to blink his eyes were all a part of it. Finally after battling it for 6 months, I couldn't watch him suffer anymore for my own selfishness. 
It was horrible. 

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## debrawade10 (Oct 10, 2013)

Zorana1125 said:


> Yup that was his name. He taught me everything I know today. He ended up w autoimmune disease a few months after his 1 year booster and rabies. It was a very long and expensive 6 months, but I did learn a lot. The constant fevers, lesions/bumps on his head, stiff joints and limping, heart mumur, lesion on his bladder wall and inability to blink his eyes were all a part of it. Finally after battling it for 6 months, I couldn't watch him suffer anymore for my own selfishness.
> It was horrible.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


I can't even imagine....so sorry. I was horrified with the reaction that Raisin & Mia had. I thought they were going to die on the way back to the vet.
I was in the pharmaceutical industry, I didn't know about this...I'm sure part of the reason on annuals is the big $$$$. It usually boils down to that. RIP Gino


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## Zorana1125 (Oct 24, 2010)

debrawade10 said:


> I can't even imagine....so sorry. I was horrified with the reaction that Raisin & Mia had. I thought they were going to die on the way back to the vet.
> I was in the pharmaceutical industry, I didn't know about this...I'm sure part of the reason on annuals is the big $$$$. It usually boils down to that. RIP Gino


Thank you. It's so scary! Sometimes the reactions are not immediate either, they can show up way later. I'm glad ur girls are ok!! 

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## jesuschick (Dec 5, 2010)

I am also non-compliant with registering them with my city/county so I will get no notifications from them. My girls are not boarded and do not go to places like Petco/Petsmart for nail trims (where you must show proof of rabies immunization). An issue would be if one bit a stranger and I had to provide proof that I would not have. Guess if I was sued, that is a reason we have the big umbrella insurance policy.

So, they have each had 2 Rabies shots, so they should be good to 14-16 years old. I am done. They already get no other shots or annual boosters. My Vet will gladly see them and will know never to ask me again.


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## teetee (Aug 25, 2011)

Zorana1125 said:


> Yup that was his name. He taught me everything I know today. He ended up w autoimmune disease a few months after his 1 year booster and rabies. It was a very long and expensive 6 months, but I did learn a lot. The constant fevers, lesions/bumps on his head, stiff joints and limping, heart mumur, lesion on his bladder wall and inability to blink his eyes were all a part of it. Finally after battling it for 6 months, I couldn't watch him suffer anymore for my own selfishness.
> It was horrible.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


So Gino got his series of puppy shots, rabies, and 1 year booster?


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## teetee (Aug 25, 2011)

Zorana1125 said:


> Yup that was his name. He taught me everything I know today. He ended up w autoimmune disease a few months after his 1 year booster and rabies. It was a very long and expensive 6 months, but I did learn a lot. The constant fevers, lesions/bumps on his head, stiff joints and limping, heart mumur, lesion on his bladder wall and inability to blink his eyes were all a part of it. Finally after battling it for 6 months, I couldn't watch him suffer anymore for my own selfishness.
> It was horrible.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


I'm so sorry you lost your boy  That had to be hard for you and him.


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## alphioz (Apr 16, 2013)

I am sorry your baby had a reaction. I guess I am among the minority on this. I vaccinate for distemper and bordatella yearly and rabies every 3 years. I have been lucky that none of my dogs have reactions. But since I bring my dogs to work often (vet clinic) and board them monthly, I don't feel comfortable not vaccinating them. I am exposed daily to potentially deadly things, distemper, parvo, etc and just don't want to take the chance having had a 2 of my previous puppies die of parvo. There are also frequent rabies outbreaks in this area and have had two dogs presented for quarantine paperwork in the last few months from being bitten by rabid raccoons in their yards. I respect everyone's decision to do what is best for their puppy's =)


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## Zorana1125 (Oct 24, 2010)

teetee said:


> So Gino got his series of puppy shots, rabies, and 1 year booster?


Ya he got 3 pup shots and theb rabies, the following year he got his booster and rabies again. I can't exclude that he didn't have a genetic predisposition to his autoimmune issue bc his breeder was hardly reputable (I didn't know much at the time other than I wanted him). But the hollostic vet (dr karen becker, she's kinda famous) said that's what caused it. All of the traditional vets I saw would never admit that. 

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## Saqqara (Feb 14, 2013)

Glad your baby is ok. Sounds like a scary thing to go through.

Cairo has only seen the vet once since I got him. He was a slightly "older" pup when I got him, so he had been given all his shots, including Rabies. At the vet, the vet assistants asked if I had gotten any paperwork with Cai. I gave them the shot record the breeder gave me. Right away one of them said, "Oh, he is missing his Leptospirosis and Bordetella shot." I told her I did NOT want him taking those shots, especially not the Lepto shot. He was there just for a check up and heartworm meds. When we were called in the back, the vet assistant starts taking out the 7-in-1 vaccine and the Bordetella vaccine. :foxes15: I had to repeat that I did not want him taking it. The vet asked if I planned on bringing him around other dogs or groomers because he could be in danger of getting kennel cough. I just said, "He will be fine. I don't want him taking those." She dropped it. 

Thank goodness for this forum. The breeder told me not to let the vet give anymore shots, but I probably would have caved when the vet suggested it. Who knows what could have happened??


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## lulu'smom (Jan 4, 2012)

Karen, I'm so sorry Eden went through that! Lulu is almost 6 years old, and I am done with shots for her. I knew nothing but what my vet told me until I joined this forum, so Lulu had her annual shots including rabies for the first 3 years of her life. I do take her to the groomer to have her nails clipped and gland checked, but I don't leave her, and they don't ever ask me about shots (I guess they assume she's up on them). Frankly, I'm debating tittering her because I just feel like she's OK with what she's had. Other than the groomer she's just never in a position for her shots to come into question. I live in Alabama, and I don't know if we are even required to register our pets with the state.


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## Lindsayj (Apr 18, 2012)

lulu'smom said:


> Karen, I'm so sorry Eden went through that! Lulu is almost 6 years old, and I am done with shots for her. I knew nothing but what my vet told me until I joined this forum, so Lulu had her annual shots including rabies for the first 3 years of her life. I do take her to the groomer to have her nails clipped and gland checked, but I don't leave her, and they don't ever ask me about shots (I guess they assume she's up on them). Frankly, I'm debating tittering her because I just feel like she's OK with what she's had. Other than the groomer she's just never in a position for her shots to come into question. I live in Alabama, and I don't know if we are even required to register our pets with the state.


We don't have to register with the state, Tina. 


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## Triciad (Dec 24, 2012)

I have also looked into titers here in southern ontario
I have to go to a vet 1/2 hr away to have them done and they are accepted by law however it casts about 3x as much as vaccinating
I am past due on my 2 adult dogs but am refusing until I have to for vet attention then titers instead I hope
My boys had their 3 sets of puppy shots last year so they should be good for at least 2 more years
I hope to save up enough to have titers done in place of vaccines 
It is truly sad that vets seem so hung ho on all vaccines
I have also read many times that distemper is actually good for closer to 10 yr
I also don't use heart worm meds as I don't agree with pumping them full of pesticides 
I am switching to the out of town vet because at least she is into natural methods and won't look at me like I have 3 heads 😀 


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## nabi (Nov 25, 2004)

How scary for you Karen...and for Eden...it was a good thing you had given the Benadryl beforehand ! I am of the age to remember when rabies shots were only given every 7 years !


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## Huly (Mar 5, 2012)

I hate it! Northern VA requires us to register or if you deny a shot the vet to notify the county. They will stop you anywhere checking your county registration rabies etc. I have seen them randomly checking dogs walking the neighborhood. They will only accept an exemption if there is a serious health reaction documented and tigers don't count.


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## woodard2009 (Aug 4, 2010)

I'm sorry Karen!! I don't do shots with Midgie either for this very reason. I'm so glad that you pretreated with Benedryl!! GIve your pup lots of hugs & kisses from Midgie & I.


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## chihmah (Sep 22, 2013)

hi I haven't had any trouble so far with buster or little rosie but thank all of yall for letting me know what is going on how horrible can I get that exemption in Louisiana?


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