# New Dogs, Advice needed!



## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

Hello, we just today picked up two Chi's, a 1 year old intact male and a 6 month old intact male. They are both marking everything in the house, marked about 10 things already... not sure what to do! Will neutering stop this?


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## proudpeyotemama (Feb 20, 2012)

With my boy, neutering stopped him from marking almost instantly. Wish you the best! Chi's are great dogs, you will absolutely adore them.


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## pupluv168 (Mar 7, 2012)

Neutering may or may not stop the behavior. Once they start, it can be hard to stop. In some dogs, however, neutering *does* eliminate the urge to mark. It depends on the dog and how young they are when neutered. If you get them done now, you might have good luck, especially with the puppy. With that being said, training can work wonders! Often, they can be trained to only mark outside. 

Neutering will also help with training and behavior if they are neutered. Intact males can be difficult to work with. 

Also, belly bands can keep them from marking in the house. Here is an example to show you what they look like. You can find them cheaper than that though. Amazon.com: PlayaPup Dog Belly Bands for Male Dogs with Incontinence Problems/Training - Print: Clothing


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

The other problem is the 1 year old is extremely underweight. The lady we got them from was a breeder getting out of the business and said he's been like that since a pup, he wont put on weight. He seems healthy enough, he has a TON of energy. When he is outside he never stops. Any tips for putting some meat on his bones? You can see every rib and even his hip bones.


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## svdreamer (Feb 20, 2010)

Thank you so much for rescuing these two boys. I found with new males in a house, they will mark the first couple of days whether they are neutered or not because it's a new place. You can check into belly bands, they are strips of fabric with a velcro attachment that goes around their waist and over their privates and you can put a sanitary napkin in and it keeps them from marking until they can be neutered. 

Dog Belly Bands & Dog Diapers by Kennel Komforts


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

pictures of the 1 year old, "Chico". Breeder insists he's always been this size and just does not eat much. She says he will get a piece of kibble, go lay down and eat it and go get another one. She said she tried different foods and he's been checked out by a vet. They are also both scared of EVERYTHING! feeling a bit overwhelmed and like we may have bit off more then we can chew with these two guys.


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

any tips on fattening the little guy up? Should I feed him treats when he's not to crazy about his regular food? they only marked once that I could see today and i'm not sure what one it was so hopefully it will pass after a few days! if not its belly band time!


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## Little_em00 (Jun 16, 2012)

Wow he is shockingly thin. There are such things as lean dogs but he looks emaciated. If it were me I would free feed so leave a bowl of kibble down all day and tempt him with things like homemade chicken soup, good luck and hang in there


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## AussieLass (Mar 1, 2012)

OMG I've only looked at 2 photos, saw the words "breeder said" and I had to back out a million miles an hour before I burst into tears and started cussing bad enough to get banned.

Please, please get that dog to the vet ASAP and be sure to take some fresh poo along for them to test. THEN get him on ZiwiPeak, at least until he's at a healthy weight - it's NOT expensive when a dog's life is at stake, and you only feed the smallest amount. 

When I'm up to it I'll go back & read/see but right now all I can think of is that poor, poor little dog - the breeder needs horsewhipping and then thrown in prison for a very long time, what a low-life AH of the worst kind she is - she's not a breeder, she's an oxygen thieving moron who should be named and shamed on TV if that's what her dogs look like. *Your Chico could be the poster boy for Animal Rescue Centres worldwide!!!*

Thank goodness for novice angels like you who can see through the ugliness of his current appearance and yet still be prepared to take him home. *You didn't just "get" a couple of Chi's, you saved their lives!* God, I'm all teared up and it takes an awful lot to do that to me.


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## michele (Jan 12, 2009)

That is terrible,she probably starved him,they maybe marking through fear as well poor little things,you can see from the way he's standing he looks pettrified but i'm sure with TLC you will bring them round.


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

I'm not to sure what to think of the breeder at this point. The other dog we got from her is a very healthy weight. However I have noticed that he bullies chico and does not let him eat, he will growl and snap if he goes near the food bowl. So it's almost like he was scared to eat. He also wont touch the kibble she gave me, which seems to large for them. I went yesterday and got Royal Canine Chi brand, and some wet food and mixed that together and he went nuts for it. She did have several other dogs there (she's re homing all of them) and Chico was the only one that was at all thin. I feel like she had to many dogs and could not properly care for them or notice that the other dogs where not letting Chico eat. 

She seemed like a really nice lady, and genuinely loved these dogs but I think its pretty clear she had to many animals to properly care for them. Chico is over a year old, was one of her studs and he does not even know his name. Eddie is 6 months and didn't know his name either. 

Having said all that her place was incredibly well kept, very clear, they had fresh water and food at all times (chico was to scared to eat it though). They are both scared of everything but slowly coming around. They are really bonding to the kids. It's tough to train them not to mark or how to walk on a leash, etc right now because they are soooo scared of everything. I caught Eddie marking last night and yelled "hey" to try and get him to stop and he freaked right out.


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## AussieLass (Mar 1, 2012)

Hmm, well taking all that into account, maybe she isn't QUITE the demon I portrayed her as, and jail is perhaps a little harsh, but everything else still stands, including the horsewhipping 

I don't care if a breeder has 2,000 "studs", there is absolutely NO excuse for working one, or allowing one to live, in the physical condition this beautiful boy is in - she is an animal terrorist and a criminal imo, regardless of how pleasant she was. Puppy farmers can be the nicest people you'll ever meet, despite being pond scum.

Unfortunately the Royal Canin is far from being a great, or even a halfway good food, but it's probably still 1,000% better than the undoubtedly glorified _cardboard _she would've had them on.

You might have to separate them so he can eat and eat and eat - building up slowly of course. He needs lots of TLC to regain everything, even his little soul by the sounds of it.

You'll probably find these boys will continue to mark until they're neutered. If you can find one of those discount vet surgeries, it actually works out a whole lot cheaper in the long run, rather than belly bands, enzymatic cleaning fluids etc. etc. It will also cut down the risk of certain illnesses later in life, unnecessary aggression - you weren't thinking of breeding with these boys were you?


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## Angel1210 (Mar 14, 2011)

I agree with Dee. He is far too thin. She is probably correct in her saying that he doesn't eat much. Sounds like the other one won't let him! They definitely need to be either separated or watched over like a hawk when they eat. I had to sit between my golden and my chi when I first got him (the chi). He would steal the golden's food and she would let him! Now, I just put their food down with some distance, stand there while they eat, and keep him in his place. If a piece of her food comes out of her bowl, he doesn't rush over to get it - he stays put! Again, at treat time I have to put the chi in his crate for treats that are more than one bite or he will steal hers right out of her mouth! 

Remember, you just got them! They need to adapt to a new environment and new rules. I don't know that I would give him extra treats. I think, like Dee said, ZP for their food.

Good luck. He is adorable!


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## TinyTails (Jun 24, 2011)

poor baby  That dog is clearly emaciated...you need to be careful not to overfeed at this point. He needs to put on weight slowly by getting many small meals. If he suddenly overeats after not being used to it he's in danger of getting sick. I work for a shelter and when we get dogs that skinny they always need to be monitored by a vet and fed small frequent meals so that their system is not overloaded. Here's an article with some information from PetMD http://http://www.petmd.com/dog/nutrition/evr_dg_care_of_the_emaciated_dog?page=2#.UBFQdKCjk3w

Good luck and thank you for saving these babies and giving them a better life


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## DKT113 (Nov 26, 2011)

My Mom found an emaciated dog on her mail route 2 December's ago. It did require round the clock monitoring / gentle feeding & it took a considerable amount of time to get out of the woods...

When you are introducing food to an emaciated dog you have to watch as the animals vital organs can shut down from overload. The weight obviously needs to come back on but you have to go about it at a slower pace to protect the internal organs.

Honestly this dog needs needs medical attention A.S.A.P
Parasites will need to be checked as well as his organs.
Additionally the dog will most likely be cold (because it is malnourished) an it is burning calories to keep itself warm. At this point you want his calories to nourish his body opposed to being burnt up needlessly keeping him warm.

I am seriously going to caution you in overfeeding this poor dog. You can do more damage than good at this point. And please, schedule with a vet immediately.


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## MamaTank (Jul 22, 2012)

Oh gosh, poor little guy!  Thank you for taking them on, and good luck!


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## svdreamer (Feb 20, 2010)

He looks as bad as Pepe did when he was rescued off the streets. Poor little boy. I free fed Pepe a good food and no treats at all. He needs to eat the good stuff because you don't want to overload his system and the treats do not have everything he needs to get back into shape. Definately keep him seperated from the other dog at mealtimes or put him in a pen several times a day with a bowl of food. He will gain slowly but I remember how happy I was the day I could pet Pepe and not feel bones. It took about a month. If the other is a good weight, try getting him fixed first. I went to my SPCA and they sponser a low cost spay/neuter clinic and give a $20 off coupon. To do a male's neuter and rabies shot comes to $47. Where are you located? If you are in the states, call your local SPCA ans see what they offer.


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## LostLakeLua (Sep 6, 2009)

That poor baby!! =( He looks as bad as Gatsby did when we first got him a few years ago. He probably was just the "bottom of the pack", the most submissive and therefor if the breeder was free-feeding, maybe he never even got to eat his share. =( I guess all I can say about her is I am glad she's rehoming her dogs; but I'm hoping it's not one of those cases where a BYB is just trying to "refresh" their stock by getting rid of the "old and used" ones. The simple fact that she gave away her dogs *unneutered* raises a big flag; regardless of how emotionally attached or caring she was, it's irresponsible to rehome an intact pet. At the very least they should've been on a neuter contract.
While neutering will not immediately stop the habit of marking; it WILL eliminate the testosterone-urge to BE marking every little thing. Wearing a belly band indoors AFTER neutering; and lots of good enzyme pee remover spray, will help nip that problem in the bud. I'd say on average; after we have an intact marker fixed; they'll wear a band maybe 4-5 weeks afterwards in the house; and by that point they've stopped marking all together and we can ditch the bands. I take in a lot of fosters, many who are not potty trained, so I've learned to avoid problems before they begin lol!
That said, thank you for saving these guys lives; just imagine what would've happen if another BYB snatched these boys up and kept studding them out. 
I don't know if you're open to the idea; but if you aren't able to get ZiwiPeak; raw diet is VERY inexpensive for little dogs. There's a little learning curve but everyone here is super supportive and has helped MANY "raw newbies" adjust; myself included over a year ago! Many people are shocked at what a difference it makes compared to dog kibble. Don't get me wrong though, ZP is excellent stuff and we love keeping some hand; but it's availability near me is limited whereas we have grocery stores everywhere around us where we can get meat. If on average we're getting things like beef or pork heart, organ, and chicken necks; all of those are 99cents per pound or under. No joke- we can feed all 7 pets (thats six 4-6lb dogs; and one 2lb kitten.) for under $2 a day. 
Good luck with these boys and I hope you'll stick around and keep us updated on how these boys adjust. If you've got any questions don't hesitate to ask; this forum is super helpful! =) Thanks again for saving these boys!


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## AussieLass (Mar 1, 2012)

Please, please keep us updated on this beautiful boy, we'd all love to see pics as you love and nurture him back to health. There's a gal on here, "LS" who's been doing the same with her new little girl "Bella" and the difference in her after just a few weeks of seeing the vet and having the best food has been astounding, both physically and mentally.


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

thanks for all of the tips guys. The vet said he just needs some meat on his bones! He's a really really finicky eater. We have him on kibble and wet food, he loves the kibble. No worries with over feeding him, he has very little interest in food. 

We got belly band for Eddie today so they have had a lot more "run of the house". They spend most of there time snuggle on the couch haha.


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## Chi Nation (Mar 7, 2012)

*Thats awful!!! It makes me sick how some psople can starve a dog. Even on a low tight budget one can at least feed cheap low grade food. Anything is better than nothing at all. That breeder should be reported immediately! How did the other dogs in the household look?*


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## Bentley J (Jun 26, 2012)

I saw the picture and it broke my heart the poor little fella looks starved hope he starts to put on weight now that you have rescued him once he gains trust in you he might not be so frightened of everything 


Sent from my iPhone using PG Free


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## Huly (Mar 5, 2012)

OMG! I have written and deleted this post about five times as I had to get my temper under control. I agree with Dee's first post. There is no excuse for this and it is the breeder's responsibility to prevent it. Finances, life, etc no excuse. If I was in your situation I do not care how clean everything looked I would report them for animal cruelty. 

Thank you for saving them. He will be a joy once you get through the rough spots. I would definitely feed them separate. In the rescue world most food aggression is learned from starvation or having to fight for their food. I am not sure if this happened but it looks like it is possible. I would definitely get both of them on a good diet asap. 

I wish both of you all the luck and please keep us up to date on their progress.


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## kimr (Nov 14, 2010)

I have a little skinny guy with a clean bill of health who just will NOT gain weight. He is one year old and weighs just under 3 lbs. I have been giving him a teaspoon of Nutrical mixed in with wet food every day. He has put on a few ounces, but he's never going to be a big boy.

He is nowhere near as thin as your boy is. Get him vet checked, then feed him seperately - whatever it takes to get him eating better. 

My other two have a fit because Diesel gets what they view as "special treatment", but if he didn't, he would be so frail that I would worry myself to death. The other two get dry food only. 

Make sure you feed a high quality high protein dry food, too!


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## ~LS~ (Oct 29, 2011)

Hi there,

Did the vet you took them to run any tests on your boys? Have they been wormed?

Most important thing right now is to get them both _properly_ evaluated
by the vet and put them on a healthy balanced diet such as ZiwiPeak
or a grain-free Acana. Then my next priority would be getting both of
them neutered asap and of course providing them with some basic positive
reinforcement training.


How did you find these two?(if you don't mind me asking)


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

thanks guys! will keep everyone up to date on his progress. To the person who asked all of the other animals in perfect condition. She had a huge air conditioned kennel for the dogs and they all had indoor/outdoor space that was spotless. I don't know that the place always looked like this, but its by far the nicest breeder setup I have ever seen. She didn't get into to much detail but she was an older lady who I think just couldn't care for all the dogs she had any longer.


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

yes, fecal tests and yes dewormed. 

We actually returned the royal canine and went with a grain free store brand food, performatrin i believe it was along with some blue canned food. 

Found them on Kijiji. She had an ad for Eddie and we went to get him and Chico was in the kennel with him and we couldn't leave him there so we took him too. Feeling a bit overwhelmed with all of the issues they have and the price we paid we could have just bought a puppy. But these two guys need a home too! 



~LS~ said:


> Hi there,
> 
> Did the vet you took them to run any tests on your boys? Have they been wormed?
> 
> ...


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## ChiMama5 (Jun 29, 2012)

Bless you for your kindness & I'm sure the love you give these boys will be returned to you many times over. Good luck & I'm sure with gentle care & affection you will turn things around.


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## AussieLass (Mar 1, 2012)

mikeandamy said:


> Found them on Kijiji. She had an ad for Eddie and we went to get him and Chico was in the kennel with him and we couldn't leave him there so we took him too. Feeling a bit overwhelmed with all of the issues they have and the price we paid we could have just bought a puppy. But these two guys need a home too!


She charged you for Chico??? Holy hell batman, she should've given him to you free, gratis and for nothing, and then been bloody grateful you took him. What a sad and greedy woman.

I don't know anything about the American dog foods but if you google Dog Food Advisor, he really does need to be on a five star rated food - every single morsel counts for this poor little guy.


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## Huly (Mar 5, 2012)

AussieLass said:


> She charged you for Chico??? Holy hell batman, she should've given him to you free, gratis and for nothing, and then been bloody grateful you took him. What a sad and greedy woman.


AGREED 100% She should have paid you to take him! :foxes15:


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## pam6400 (Oct 5, 2008)

Thank you for taking these darlings into your home. You will not be sorry, yes it is a lot of work and big commitment but you will be rewarded in a thousand ways! :angel8:


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## DKT113 (Nov 26, 2011)

mikeandamy said:


> The vet said he just needs some meat on his bones!


I will agree there are some dogs that are naturally on the thinner side & there are some that "just need some meat on their bones" & then there are dogs who are in severe distress and the issue becomes more imperative than looking at the dog and saying he needs some meat on his bones. You are in the imperative situation. There is a difference in a "thin" dog & a dog in which you can see every bone where there is no tissue or muscle visible.

I would be very apprehensive of a vet who looked at that dog in that condition and the diagnosis was "he needs some meat on his bones". I feel confident my 6 year old would have offered more helpful information than that. Nursing him back to health is round the clock dedication initially, small amounts of healthy food every 4-6 hours, monitoring bowel movements & urine output. To calculate what is needed you would start with what he would eat at a healthy weight and divide into portions spread evenly throughout the day. There are also foods you can make at home that will be less stressful on his internal organs that are seriously at risk of shutting down should the wrong foods be introduced in too large a portion. Really you need the advice of a qualified Vet who is able to determine what his fat/ necessary mineral content ratios should be based on his current condition.

It's truly wonderful that you have gotten him away from that woman. She obviously watched him deteriorate to this condition and couldn't be bothered to assist him earlier. In my book there is no way to justify the conditions in which she makes excuses for the physical and mental shape that dog is currently in. So you have done a wonderful thing, but honestly that was step 1 and step 2 - through full recovery is going to take some doing on your part and it's going to involve more than separating the 2 dogs to eat.

I am also going to guess this dog cuddles with the other one because they are familiar, but also because he is skin and bones and needs warmth. Please get a tube sock cut off the toe area, make two small snips for his legs to go through and allow him to wear it to keep himself warm so that calories needed for nutrition aren't being wasted generating heat for his little body. It will help with the process of bringing him back to health. Keeping him warm is so important. 

Make sure he is not dehydrated: gently pinch a fold in his skin if it goes flat quickly he is hydrated, if it stays pinched/ dissipates slowly he is dehydrated and he needs water. Also check his gums they should be pink. If they are greyish or white he is anemic.

You will be amazed at how he turns around, but he is going to need your dedication to allow that to happen. It took us about a month to save our last one & I would say he was in about the same shape as your little guy, but he was a much larger dog. I honestly could not have done so without the help of my vet. She got us through it. Guided us along the way to make sure his organs did not shut down and set the foundation for proper tissue and muscular growth. 

It was very concerning to me to read your vet so nonchalantly stated the obvious and he/she didn't offer any helpful/ practical medical advise to assist this little guy. If he/she did you didn't share that ~ from going through this in the past I do know it is very serious, can't be taken lightly and there is more to it than putting a food bowl down to put meat on his bones. At his grave state food most likely makes him ill ~ so it isn't a case of being finicky~ he is in starvation mode and doing all he knows how to do internally to spare his body from hurting any more than what it already does. 

Please get with a vet or a rescue group who has experience in this and get some specific guidelines on how to nurse this little guy back to health properly. And please keep us posted on how he is progressing.


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

thanks for the great post! lots of useful information!


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## pam6400 (Oct 5, 2008)

Hi, was wondering how Chico is doing today? How is his appetite?


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## AussieLass (Mar 1, 2012)

DKT, what a fabulous post, thank you!

You know MikeandAmy, we all would dearly love to see pics of Chico's progression, be it weekly, fortnightly, whatever you can manage to we can share in the joy of seeing him recuperate and watch you guys right this wrong.

This may sound corny & soppy, even feigned, but we folks here really do care and think constantly about pups that need lots of love and positive healing energy sent their way, and you too for all the effort you're putting in to this darling little man. Even 'ol hard-a$$es like me have been known to shed a tear over the odd doggy and their dilemmas, and this is definitely one of those doggies that occupies many of my thoughts.


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## 4bsingreece (Apr 11, 2012)

Wow! You are their angel saving them. You probably hit the nail on the head to him be bullied over the food. These guys will love you for saving them and giving them a great home! I look forward to seeing all the progress!


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

Hey everyone! I thought it was about time for an update. We wound up rehoming Eddie, it was just to much to have him as far as medical costs go and with all of the time that we have been putting into Chico. We had no problem at all finding Eddie a great home as his only real issue was that he was not house broken. The other factor in it was that Eddie was a big bully to Chico and Chico was overly dependent on him. Without Eddie here it has forced Chico to come out of his shell a bit and do things for himself, not just follow Eddie. 

He's still underweight, and has not been fixed yet as we would like to get him at a healthier stronger weight first. He is really coming around and turning into an actual dog! He's not scared of every little noise though he is still very jumpy. He also has started following us around the house the odd time. He is not marking in the house anymore, but he does have the odd accident. The kids absolutely adore him, they fight over who gets to cuddle him!

Before: 



















3 weeks later


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## DKT113 (Nov 26, 2011)

Thank you for the update. I have been stewing about this little guy and have wondered about him daily. I was hoping an update was coming.

I see hope in his face in the last picture. Trust and hope ~ that's just so wonderful. It's wonderful that you and your family are able to do this for him. 

I know our recent guy was very abused and not fed at the home 2 before ours. He's been here a little under a month and at times he's still "jumpy" ~ the other day we had a fly get into the house & I grabbed a swatter, it brought something back for him, he was terrified. Hardest fly I ever killed, just because I knew what swatting it brought back to him, but I had to show him ~ it's ok if the swatter comes out here. Little things have happened here that we can easily see reminds him of the life he escaped (sounds, sudden movements) but even with that every day he gives us a little something that lets us know he is becoming comfortable. Tonight he actually initiated play with my son and he is terrified of men, or was become he came home. It's amazing what they can go through and still at the end of the day all they want to do is love and be loved. 

As far as his accidents. At this point I honestly wouldn't be concerned. Yes you want him housebroken. The fact that you have only had a few accidents in his very frail state though, I am sure once he is back to health you aren't going to have a problem in that area. His internals have been tested to the max. He really is doing amazing to only have had a few accidents.

He's just beautiful ~ and he's a little miracle. You guys are doing a totally amazing job with him and please if you are able post updates a little more frequently. That was such a long wait, but so worth it.


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## ~LS~ (Oct 29, 2011)

mikeandamy said:


> Hey everyone! I thought it was about time for an update. We wound up rehoming Eddie, it was just to much to have him as far as medical costs go and with all of the time that we have been putting into Chico. We had no problem at all finding Eddie a great home as his only real issue was that he was not house broken. The other factor in it was that Eddie was a big bully to Chico and Chico was overly dependent on him. Without Eddie here it has forced Chico to come out of his shell a bit and do things for himself, not just follow Eddie.
> 
> He's still underweight, and has not been fixed yet as we would like to get him at a healthier stronger weight first. He is really coming around and turning into an actual dog! He's not scared of every little noise though he is still very jumpy. He also has started following us around the house the odd time. He is not marking in the house anymore, but he does have the odd accident. The kids absolutely adore him, they fight over who gets to cuddle him!




You re-homed Eddie, the dog you just bought, due to high medical costs,
correct? I'm guessing you found adoptive parents that are willing to pay 
these costs?

And what is Chico eating right now? It's hard to tell from the photos, but I
don't see improvements regarding his body condition. Three weeks on a high
quality diet should have given you better results, unless there are medical
problems preventing him from putting on weight. Have you taken him back to
the vet's for any testing?

I really want to see your dog do well, which is why I ask questions. If I can
be of any help regarding nutrition & weight gain or training please let me
know.


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## Kelliope (Mar 11, 2011)

I agree with LS. There should be much more improvement in 3 weeks. I am concerned your dog may have EPI or some other underlying medical problem. Please visit this site for more info. Overview - EPI * Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency

It is especially concerning since you stated that Chico was the only dog that was thin at the breeders. Please, please take him back to the vet for bloodwork. He should be gaining much more weight, imo. Bless you for taking him on. I hope his friend found a great home.


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## LostLakeLua (Sep 6, 2009)

I agree with the others. Has Chico been seen by a vet since his first checkup a few weeks ago? I too hate to say it, but I don't see too much difference n the before/after. I know it's hard to tell by photos alone, but for 3 weeks it doesn't seem like there's much progress (even taking into consideration that he should be gaining weight slowly). 
My advice would be another vet checkup, but forget everything they tell you about nutrition (haha sorry... but if they sell Hills in their clinic it's safe to say they are not properly educated regarding canine nutrition.) To quote many people on this forum, you really need to find the best quality food you can afford and stick with it. For such a tiny guy, the cost to feed is minimal even with an excellent grain-free food. Do make sure the vets run labwork (they'll take a blood sample) as that will be a better indicator if he's fighting off some kind of infection or what is going on internally. Not to alarm you or anything; but dogs, even chi's, are resilient little creatures who hide discomfort and suffering quite well. Even if he appears to be content on the outside, there could still be something going on internally and the earlier you figure out the cause, the more likely he is to recover.
And also, I hate to say this too, but I would also report the "breeder." Your photos you posted earlier are all the evidence you'd need... The fact that she actually asked you to pay for Chico, instead of willingly surrendering/giving him to you (someone who is actually taking care of him; when it's obvious his needs were not being met there!!) is just tragic. As someone said earlier, what a sad greedy woman. 
Please keep us posted on the little guy and let us know what the vets say. I sincerely hope this guy improves, and am glad to here he's making some progress. Best wishes!


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## mikeandamy (Jul 24, 2012)

we have had several people comment when seeing him in person on how much better he looks. It may just be hard to tell from the pictures. Also 3 weeks ago everyone on here was commenting on how long a process it is and not to expect results overnight, you guys are hard to please  haha. His blood work from a few weeks ago was fine, and he's due back for a follow up at the one month mark. Medically speaking I am leaving him in the hands of the Vet to do what they think is required, no offense to you guys. 

He's on Royal Canine food and we also give him some wet food although for the past week he's actually started eating dry food. 

Regarding Eddie, we re-homed him because of the high medical costs for Chico, not Eddie. All Eddie needs is his set of shots and neutering. Chico has check ups, needs dental surgery, shots, neutering etc. As well as a lot of attention. It would be very hard to find someone else to do that so we decided to focus our efforts on him and getting him back to health for now. On top of that Eddie saw Chico as the very weak link and did not like him at all. Chico loved Eddie though lol. Eddie would attack Chico for eating, trying to get attention from us, etc. So not having him here for the past week has really helped Chico come out of his shell. Eddie is currently at a rescue group, he does not have his forever home yet.


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

I have to agree with the others. I don't see much, if any, improvement after 3 weeks. He still looks emaciated.  His spine and hipbones are extremely prominent, which indicates starvation. IF he is eating, it is not processing. 

How much is he eating per day? How many times does he poop? 

There should have been steady improvement over 3 weeks. You can check out the pics of Bella, LS new rescue and see her dog's body condition over the same length of time and the differences are very noticeable.

I agree with Kelliope that he may have something else going on such as EPI. He is not processing the food he is given. 

If he were mine, I'd seek another vets opinion. I don't think royal canine is doing the job for him at all. He needs intensive care at this point.


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## ~LS~ (Oct 29, 2011)

mikeandamy said:


> we have had several people comment when seeing him in person on how much better he looks. It may just be hard to tell from the pictures. Also 3 weeks ago everyone on here was commenting on how long a process it is and not to expect results overnight, you guys are hard to please  haha. His blood work from a few weeks ago was fine, and he's due back for a follow up at the one month mark. Medically speaking I am leaving him in the hands of the Vet to do what they think is required, no offense to you guys.
> 
> He's on Royal Canine food and we also give him some wet food although for the past week he's actually started eating dry food.
> 
> Regarding Eddie, we re-homed him because of the high medical costs for Chico, not Eddie. All Eddie needs is his set of shots and neutering. Chico has check ups, needs dental surgery, shots, neutering etc. As well as a lot of attention. It would be very hard to find someone else to do that so we decided to focus our efforts on him and getting him back to health for now. On top of that Eddie saw Chico as the very weak link and did not like him at all. Chico loved Eddie though lol. Eddie would attack Chico for eating, trying to get attention from us, etc. So not having him here for the past week has really helped Chico come out of his shell. Eddie is currently at a rescue group, he does not have his forever home yet.



Vets are fabulous, they truly are, BUT I believe you must not only listen to
their advice but also do your own research, ask them questions regarding your
research and state your concerns. Your dog may likely have other issues
other than malnourishment, that are contributing to his condition. It is crucial 
to feed him a high quality, high or at the very least moderate protein diet,
preferably grain free with supplements & extra "non dog foods" such as satin
balls amounting to max 10% of that diet. You should be keeping a diary of his daily
intake(how much he ate at each meal) & monitoring his stools. At the very
minimum he needs to be weighed each week to see if he is progressing or not.
If he is not, there may be need to force feed, which you NEVER attempt alone
without first discussing on how to properly do it with your vet. Royal Canine is
not a good quality food. It is more crucial than ever for your dog to eat a well
balanced diet right now, if you need help finding the right food don't hesitate
to ask. Right now he needs to eat 5 times per day, small amounts, the total
per 24 hours should amount to his recommended feeding amount at a healthy
weight, not his current weight. And yes 3 weeks is not a very long time, but it
is enough time to see a slight improvement. Slowly but surely will do the trick,
IF there are no underlying issues.


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## DKT113 (Nov 26, 2011)

I know with our guy (severely emaciated) he took baby steps & then he blossomed. I was fortunate, I am a small walk from the vet, she's across the road at the end of our lane. He couldn't walk even that short trip but we loaded in the car about every second or third day and took him down just for the vet to to take a look at. We probably had a minimum of 20 pop ins, no charge, just advice encouragement, etc. In pictures that I can't even look at I do remember not seeing much of a difference but between the vet and family looking every day and commenting I knew they were seeing improvements that my heart just wouldn't allow me see. 

I realize you don't know us and we do appear as hard to please. With that though it is just because we are truly concerned about this little joker. I see you have a vet whom you trust and that you are close to your follow up return visit also that this past week has brought about significant mental change (which is good). Please consider calling the vet and bumping up the appointment. I can't imagine going the time span you are scheduled out for under these circumstances. The first couple weeks of recovery, after rescue are so important to have overseen by a professional. 

We didn't use store bought foods initially. Our vet uses a recipe structured around the the Satin Balls recipe found on the internet ~ she adjusts based on what fat content she feels is safe to be introduced into the dog's system. What I don't know and what can't be just guessed is how you would adjust for your little guys current state. You need a qualified vet for this part. You could print out the Satin Balls recipe found on the net and take it to your vet for him/her to determine if its viable for him as it sits or if it needs tweaked. They use this information along with information about his waste production. If you aren't, please make notes about his potty habits. Noting time he ate/ drank. When he went potty and examine the potty ~ stool information as well as keeping an eye on how many times he is urinating. Take a fresh stool sample to the vet in a ziploc/baggie. You can drop a stool sample off for a fecal without an appointment. 

I know the first couple weeks were very slow going for us. We really had to watch not getting the weight on too quickly / not stressing his internals. I cried every single day round the clock & was an emotional wreck. Once we got to a certain point though and the vet knew his internals were not shutting down, things took and immediate upswing. 

Looking this morning I still see hope and trust but I feel there is just too great a time span between vet checks and really hope you will call and get bumped up if possible. I also hope you will print out the Satin Balls recipe and take with you so that it can be discussed and tweaked. Store-bought production-line kibble might not be the best choice right now (it wasn't in our situation). 

Also this is so important and can be implemented immediately and it will make a huge difference~we dressed our guy. Heat / keeping him warm is super important. I know it's summer, temps are up, but your little joker in his state is cold and he is using his calories to generate heat to keep his body warm and those calories are being wasted. Please get a tube sock on the little guy, it will help. There is absolutely no risk of medical compromise. It will make a big difference in his recovery and everyone has a sock at home that can be used. This video will you show you what to do and it takes a minute to construct. It gets no easier than this: 



 If nothing else please get him a little sock sweater so the calories he is burning up for heat can be used to nourish his body.

And just keep us posted. We might seem like a bunch of nuts but I promised you even though I am a nut, I am a nut who cares and the rest of the ladies care as well & all of the posts discussing this come from the right place. We're not trying to knock you or harp on you we're just doing what we can to help you get him through this. Vets aren't always 100% spot on so it never hurts to take on board what others have to say in regards to a medical issue. It actually helps you get the most you can out of your visit with the vet.


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