# Is it so bad to have a large chi?



## MarieUkxx (May 19, 2009)

I was just reading another thread. Is it so bad to have a large Chi. Lola is very big, I'd say the biggest on here but she's a beautiful little girl with the best personality. Is it so bad she's big?


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## OurCheekyChihuahuas (Nov 18, 2009)

Im sure shes not too big! SHes very cute definately! That other girl to me clearly looks like a large chi cross anyway!


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## JRZL (Jul 10, 2009)

i dont think its bad if a chis big if its a pet and not for show. all that matters is that you love her!


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## TinyGiant (Jan 20, 2010)

Of course not! But you are probably not breeding her either, that would be the bad part, just imo.


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## MarieUkxx (May 19, 2009)

OurCheekyChihuahuas said:


> Im sure shes not too big! SHes very cute definately! That other girl to me clearly looks like a large chi cross anyway!


I love Lolly no matter what her size. Cookie is what you'd call a proper looking Chi. Lolly is very big but I don't think it's a really bad thing. Of course she's not a show dog. But she's a perfect pet, she is so loving.

I just wondered what people honestly thought of her after reading that thread


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## TinyGiant (Jan 20, 2010)

MarieUkxx said:


> I love Lolly no matter what her size. Cookie is what you'd call a proper looking Chi. Lolly is very big but I don't think it's a really bad thing. Of course she's not a show dog. But she's a perfect pet, she is so loving.
> 
> I just wondered what people honestly thought of her after reading that thread


Did you actually READ through the other thread? Because I saw nice comments about her on there. It was just an observation that she was big and not standard chi, that is all.


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## MarieUkxx (May 19, 2009)

TinyGiant said:


> Of course not! But you are probably not breeding her either, that would be the bad part, just imo.


Oh no I wouldn't breed her BUT why would it be so bad if I were to want to? Ok she's no show dog but she's a gentle loving girl. Her pups would have lovely personalities. 

Ben my other Chi that passed was big, he was the most loving dog ever.


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## OurCheekyChihuahuas (Nov 18, 2009)

Yes Cookie & Lola are both gorgeous and look like great little companions!  x


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## MarieUkxx (May 19, 2009)

TinyGiant said:


> Did you actually READ through the other thread? Because I saw nice comments about her on there. It was just an observation that she was big and not standard chi, that is all.


Yes I did I just don't think people should put big Chis down. I didn't say everyone did.


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## TinyGiant (Jan 20, 2010)

MarieUkxx said:


> Yes I did I just don't think people should put big Chis down. I didn't say everyone did.


Well it's ok, I think both of yours are beautiful.


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## MarieUkxx (May 19, 2009)

I'm not having a go at people lol. I'm just genuinely curious that's all.


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## jade_carr (Jul 7, 2009)

what thread? what did i miss. lolly is gorgeous!! lexie is a big chi too - i'd imagine a similar size to lolly. to be honest i prefer that she's big.


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## rcj1095 (Mar 4, 2009)

Marie, I don't know exactly how big Lola is but I doubt she's the biggest chi on the forum. Either way, she is gorgeous and looks perfect to me. They really do come in so many shapes and sizes. My niece has a "bigger than standard" chi boy and he is the cutest thing in the world. Our vet calls him a freak of nature, LOL!!! He is full chi and very muscular and lots of long hair. I think the size thing only gets complicated when we are speaking of breeding to better the breed and gene pool. All your pups, as well as yourself, are gorgeous and amazing!!! That's my two cents!!!


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## MChis (Oct 13, 2009)

I just replied to you in the other thread. I get more bent out of shape when people ASSUME a Chi is a mix just because it's "large". Chi's started out being bigger & with many of the "undesireable" of todays traits. Now if those traits pop up people assume it's because they're a mix. Heck, you could have 2 show dogs produce an 8lb Chi! LOL

I certainly don't have anything against large Chi's. Milo & Matilda are both on the bigger side (8lbs & 10.8lbs - but same basic size) but I don't doubt their being a full Chi.


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## Quinn (Dec 11, 2008)

No there is nothing at all wrong with larger Chis as companions! 
Honestly having Phoebe being as small as she is, is a constant worry! I wouldn't mind having an 8-10lber at all! Easier to care for, sturdier, not as hard to find properly fitting clothes, etc etc. I think larger Chis are awesome pets.
Schroeder is btwn 5-6lbs I believe and even he seems really small to other people sometimes. 
The only time I do see something wrong with an extremely large chi is if someone is using it for breeding. That may not make sense, since I just said I think larger is better, but I believe the standards are there for a reason. If the standard called for dogs between 6-12lbs I would tell people breeding one smaller than that was bad. 
As was said even 2 dogs to the standard can produce a larger Chihuahua. And a smaller one. I don't think all these TEENY things should be being bred. Many of them are not as healthy, and most people aren't as qualified to care for them. Smaller is NOT better!
If I'm ever to own a chi again if I rescue I will definitely take a larger, if from a breeder I will try for one on the larger end of the standard.


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## msmadison (Jul 6, 2009)

i haven't read the other thread, but i think as long as your babies are healthy, size should't really matter (unless you're breeding for conformation, etc). Madi is currently tipping the scales at 7.4lbs and she's still a tiny little thing in my eyes  I love that she's a bit bigger and "sturdier", too 

I love Lolly


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## Yoshismom (Jul 6, 2005)

As other's said, absolutely not as long as you are not breeding ;-)


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## rache (Nov 10, 2009)

~Billy loves lola just the way she is! xx


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## Tracilea (Jul 27, 2009)

I too love that Luna is bigger and more sturdier because I don't need another worry like I do for Willy. Poor lil chap slipped on some ice yesterday and scraped his stump. I had a bleeder on my hands and the little bum wouldn't leave his bandaging on  He is fine today though and has a wee lil scab 

In my information gathering there is something i am curious about and I will soon do some research on it, I am wondering why and how the chi is so tiny. I wonder if THAT was somethng bred into them because 4 to 6 pounds is so tiny. I am wondering about all the problems with it from birthing difficulties to hypoglastemia. Maybe they have been bred TOO small to suit someones fancy (I mean through history not now in present time). I have heard of other breeds being bred into a whole world of problems, shorter muzzles giving eye and breathing probs (in other breeds not chi's). How far is too far right?


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## smallbeats_m_all (Nov 22, 2009)

I myself, like to be active with my dogs, so bigger bone is better for me and much safer... my bungee girl is almost too fine boned for my liking


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## Quinn (Dec 11, 2008)

Oh the problems of the breed definitely stem from their small size/shape, but with that being said, every breed no matter the height or weight has their own problems. It is inevitable. But breeders with good lines who health test try to rule out, with every new generation, the issues in the line. This is to create the small Chihuahua that people know and love with out the issues that can plauge the breed with improper breeding. 

I think that the really wee ones that are being produced now so people have "teacups" is really not good. They are just not hardy enough. Also I feel the "deer" type Chis are more prone to leg problems because while Chihuahuas are supposed to be small they are supposed to be cobby. I know Phoebe has little tiny stick legs, that I could probably snap with my pinky!


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## Bella Luna (Jan 15, 2010)

No way! There is nothing wrong with Chihuahuas who are big. For some people, it's a better fit because they aren't as fragile as the tiny ones. I got my grandma a Chihuahua for Christmas last year and she is big, but she is adorable, sweet, and has an awesome personality. There is nothing wrong with bigger Chis! And in my opinion, they are still very small when compared to other breeds of dogs. As long as the Chi is healthy, that's what matters~Lola is a cutie No worries!


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## rubia (Jul 3, 2008)

We should have a thread on "how big is your chi ?"". I have seen some big ones and some teeney ones too. Some on here have both smaller and larger...I'd love to see pic-s of al of the bigger ones.

I love Mchi-s siggy Heather's got all of hers lined up..it is really spectacular all sizes there.


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## rocky scotland (Jun 15, 2008)

Marie don't worry Lola is a doll, Rocky is a 'larger' chi as well but he is still pretty tiny really!! He is 8 and a half pounds and I love that he is a bit on the bigger side, I would have a larger one over a smaller one anyday for a pet especially, not so small and fragile!!

PS, I LOVE littles as well!!!!


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## Ivy's mom (Feb 15, 2008)

I don't think it's a problem at all. I love my teenie girls Ivy and Fern. I wanted teenies when I bought them. When looking for Willow I wanted a bigger girl that Tristan could play with. She is 9or more lbs and even though a pudge is a sweetheart. Ivy and Fern are 3 lbs but very heathly. No matter what size you just love them unconditionally. I think your little girl is precious

Lori


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

I don’t think there is anything bad/wrong with having a larger Chi. Some people actually prefer them. Maybe they have small children, work full time, larger dogs, etc. The larger Chi is much better suitable for situations like that. 

I have mentioned this in other threads, and I’d like to touch on it again here. If you look at pictures from way back, Chi’s are bigger (bigger than 2/6 lbs.) and they don’t have the look we’ve come to know as standard today. I can only assume that somewhere down the line someone decided they should be smaller, and have a different look so they started down breeding and altering lines. I also have no clue why AKC’s standard is 2/6 lbs.. Making that the standard means it should be common, the norm. But from being on different Chi websites, including this one, and observing Chi’s in my hometown, the norm isn’t even 6 lbs. The norm is more like 8 lbs. And the 8 lb. Chi’s that I see do not look “big” as many would call them. They are small dogs. I think originally Chi’s were about that size. Maybe 7/10 lbs. being the norm. It seems to me that the “original” Chi is coming back to surface. I can’t even tell in 90% of Chi’s these days that they are a Chi (to today’s standard). I also notice that so many Chi’s these days are long and tall. Standard says a Chi is not supposed to be over 9 inches long, and not over 9 inches tall. We have so many Chi’s that are longer. That would mean they are tall too. Providing they are built like a Chi, because a Chi is supposed to only be a tad bit shorter than it is long. I read the measurements in some of the measurement threads and people’s measurements for their Chi’s make up a weenie dog instead of a Chi. I just don’t get it? And these are Chi’s bred by so called reputable breeders. 

I am not sure what my feelings are on the whole thing. Do we want dogs that are so small that they have a world of health problems? Do we want dogs that are not even really “dogs?” A 3 lb. Chi is not like having a real dog in so many instances. Yeah they think like a dog, they want to do dog things, but they are quite fragile. They can’t be left roaming around unattended for extended periods. And god forbid should one that size ever get out on accident and have to fend for itself. There are so many things I could go on about regarding dogs this small. 

It also drives me batty when I see adds from show breeders (yes, show breeders) that say that “Mom is 3 lbs., Dad is 2 lbs..” I wonder at that point if they think the whole World is an idiot? I can tell you first hand that a 3 lb. pup has no where to carry babies, and if she did she might carry one, and if she made it through the pregnancy and birth it would be a miracle. A 3 lb. dog is minute, like a puppy themselves. I have even seen adds that say Mom is 2 ½ lbs. I can only shake my head in disbelief that they honestly think anyone that knows anything about Chi’s would believe that. It’s just insane! 

Basically I blame all of the misinformation that is out there, even by so called professionals for the whole lack of knowledge surrounding Chi size. 

So back to larger Chi’s. Those of you that have one or more, don’t feel like your pup is any less than a smaller one. Their genes can be coming from way back. Back when Chi’s weren’t what we know them as today. I don’t think they will ever be able to totally breed out those old lines. Genetics are genetics. They will come up somewhere. I do think that AKC should change their standard as far as weight. How many champions the size of Jade do you see? Or even Gia’s size? Chances are at that size their mouths are much to small for all of their teeth and would be disqualified due to their bite. My girls have the biggest mess of teeth in their mouths because their heads are too small to hold them all. This is very common in a tiny. So I just don’t get it! If this was “my first rodeo” maybe I wouldn’t question all of these things. 

I’m not saying that I think people should breed 10 lb. Chi’s. That isn’t what I’m saying at all. I don’t agree with random breedings at any size. I’m probably even more anal than most about breeding. I think anyone that breeds should have a license to do so. 

I also wanted to touch on something that I’ve noticed has been discussed a lot lately. Those breeding to better the breed. I see experienced breeders breeding out of standard every day. Long snouts, over sized Moms, roach backs, too long/too tall. When you are going by standard, you have to take into account the “whole” standard, not just the parts that intrigue you. :wink: 

I have to add that none of my post is directed towards anyone. I don’t know who all breeds here (I avoid most of those posts) and I don’t know who shows. So if you are reading this taking it personal, please don’t.

Sorry I was so long winded. But this topic is very interesting to me. One that I’m filled with questions about myself.


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## Bella Luna (Jan 15, 2010)

TLI said:


> I don’t think there is anything bad/wrong with having a larger Chi. Some people actually prefer them. Maybe they have small children, work full time, larger dogs, etc. The larger Chi is much better suitable for situations like that.
> 
> I have mentioned this in other threads, and I’d like to touch on it again here. If you look at pictures from way back, Chi’s are bigger (bigger than 2/6 lbs.) and they don’t have the look we’ve come to know as standard today. I can only assume that somewhere down the line someone decided they should be smaller, and have a different look so they started down breeding and altering lines. I also have no clue why AKC’s standard is 2/6 lbs.. Making that the standard means it should be common, the norm. But from being on different Chi websites, including this one, and observing Chi’s in my hometown, the norm isn’t even 6 lbs. The norm is more like 8 lbs. And the 8 lb. Chi’s that I see do not look “big” as many would call them. They are small dogs. I think originally Chi’s were about that size. Maybe 7/10 lbs. being the norm. It seems to me that the “original” Chi is coming back to surface. I can’t even tell in 90% of Chi’s these days that they are a Chi (to today’s standard). I also notice that so many Chi’s these days are long and tall. Standard says a Chi is not supposed to be over 9 inches long, and not over 9 inches tall. We have so many Chi’s that are longer. That would mean they are tall too. Providing they are built like a Chi, because a Chi is supposed to only be a tad bit shorter than it is long. I read the measurements in some of the measurement threads and people’s measurements for their Chi’s make up a weenie dog instead of a Chi. I just don’t get it? And these are Chi’s bred by so called reputable breeders.
> 
> ...


Awesome post! I agree with you. When I was looking for a Chihuahua, I was absolutely amazed to see what people post when trying to sell them, such as the teensy tiny moms being bred!! I once saw a post that was a 3 lb mom with an almost 5 lb dad!!! That can't be healthy for the mom or the puppies! But anyways, this was very interesting


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## catz4m8z (Aug 28, 2008)

I love the bigger Chi's too. They feel much less fragile and hardier. I was so pleased Heidi's mum and dad were both 6Ibs and pretty disappointed that she is only 4Ibs!! She will never be allowed off lead with the other two, she could be hurt and if her harness gets caught on something she isnt big enough to free herself.
Big or small there is a Chi to suit everyone.LOL


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## 3l3ctric (Apr 5, 2009)

I didn't read this whole thread, but wanted to say:

There's NOTHING wrong with having a big chihuahua as long as it is your pet! In fact, sometimes a larger sized dog simply suits many people's lives better, but they want the personality of a Chi. Or, their dog gets bigger than they expected. Nothing wrong there! The issue is just with breeding. There's more details about that then I want to get into right now, but I just wanted to say that you should never be ashamed of your Chi just because it is on the bigger end. 

My Ollie is about 6lb, right at the big end of the breed standard, but still a small dog. Depending on who I am walking him by, some people exclaim "oh what a small dog!" and others say "Isn't he big for a Chi??".


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## TinyGiant (Jan 20, 2010)

Yeah, my moms chi is 7 pounds and honestly I can't imagine a dog smaller than him lol. He is just so tiny to me.


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## Jerry'sMom (May 5, 2009)

My first Chi (in the 1980's) was 8 lbs. Cognac seemed like the tiniest dog to me. 
I loved him dearly. Lolly is the size she was born to be; and she is lovely


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## Tracilea (Jul 27, 2009)

T....that was so nicely said  I think they should up the weight as well because people are trying to bred them too small and causing alot of problems with it. I too have seen ads saying mom 3 pounds. I look at Willy and think oh my gosh if he were a girl and pg...WHERE would the babies go?? lol Though actually for that boys skinniness he seems to have such a big chest. I dunno if its built up like that cuz of his leg issues or what, but it does look a touch odd 
Anyway, I wanted to touch on the comments about the deer type chi as well, yes they are super fragile because of those legs!! lol Just look at Willy. My hubby said if it had been Luna who had the accident with her sturdier legs, the outcome might have been a little different. Willys long deer legs look made for breaking. The bone is SOOOOO thin that when I walk him in the sunlight, the little flap of skin between his back leg bones down by his feet, I can almost see through it, like looking through a thin fabric. I feel like if I applied pressure, I could snap his leg in half. That boy makes me nervous! lol


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## Quinn (Dec 11, 2008)

Yep exactly! I can see through Phoebe's legs as well. I HATE it! 
I can't imagine her being pregnant. I'd cry, that would kill me. I can't imagine that bein healthy or comfortable! I think MOST people who are breeding the really tiny guys just want to make the "teacups" for money.


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## Bella Luna (Jan 15, 2010)

Quinn said:


> Yep exactly! I can see through Phoebe's legs as well. I HATE it!
> I can't imagine her being pregnant. I'd cry, that would kill me. I can't imagine that bein healthy or comfortable! I think MOST people who are breeding the really tiny guys just want to make the "teacups" for money.


Agreed! This whole "teacup" thing is crazy! I see it advertised EVERYWHERE...along with the hefty price tag. When I was searching for a Chihuahua, I always thought it was interesting just to ask the question, "Well, do you have 'teacup' puppies?"..Just to see what they would say...That was kind of a way I would weed out who I wanted to get a puppy from. 

I also think it's really strange how the sizes vary in one litter or puppies though. In Bella's litter, there were 4 puppies and when I went to pick up Bella, I got to see her brother, who was about three times her size and cute as a button I still talk to the breeder because she likes to see updated picture of Bella and she said that her brother is about 3.5 lbs right now. I just think it's amazing that litters have so many different sizes of puppies, as well as colors and physical features.


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## rocky scotland (Jun 15, 2008)

TLI said:


> I don’t think there is anything bad/wrong with having a larger Chi. Some people actually prefer them. Maybe they have small children, work full time, larger dogs, etc. The larger Chi is much better suitable for situations like that.
> 
> I have mentioned this in other threads, and I’d like to touch on it again here. If you look at pictures from way back, Chi’s are bigger (bigger than 2/6 lbs.) and they don’t have the look we’ve come to know as standard today. I can only assume that somewhere down the line someone decided they should be smaller, and have a different look so they started down breeding and altering lines. I also have no clue why AKC’s standard is 2/6 lbs.. Making that the standard means it should be common, the norm. But from being on different Chi websites, including this one, and observing Chi’s in my hometown, the norm isn’t even 6 lbs. The norm is more like 8 lbs. And the 8 lb. Chi’s that I see do not look “big” as many would call them. They are small dogs. I think originally Chi’s were about that size. Maybe 7/10 lbs. being the norm. It seems to me that the “original” Chi is coming back to surface. I can’t even tell in 90% of Chi’s these days that they are a Chi (to today’s standard). I also notice that so many Chi’s these days are long and tall. Standard says a Chi is not supposed to be over 9 inches long, and not over 9 inches tall. We have so many Chi’s that are longer. That would mean they are tall too. Providing they are built like a Chi, because a Chi is supposed to only be a tad bit shorter than it is long. I read the measurements in some of the measurement threads and people’s measurements for their Chi’s make up a weenie dog instead of a Chi. I just don’t get it? And these are Chi’s bred by so called reputable breeders.
> 
> ...


WOW great post T! 

It is such an interesting subject because sizes of chis vary a lot! I really don't see Rocky as large, I mean who can call an 8lb dog large. I would be always worrying if he was smaller.


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## rcj1095 (Mar 4, 2009)

Well, I for one, sure hope they don't change the breed standard for many reasons. 

We all got our chi's because of their fantastic personalities and because we wanted smaller dogs. I have a 3 lb., two 4 lbs. and a 5 lb. chi along with an 11 lb. mini doxie (who thinks he's a chi). LOL!!! Small is obviously a matter of opinion. Coop is small also at 11 lbs. compared to a lot of dogs. To us, he's the big boy of our house.

Mine are quite sturdy and are very much like other dogs. They run, romp and roll like crazy with Coop all day long. They get up on the beds with the stairs and down by themselves. They are small but not near as "fragile" as you would think. I've watched crazy stuff with them with Coop and my sister's two bigger dogs. Sure, they can get hurt so you have to be careful but I don't keep mine in a box. They are "real" dogs and do "real" dog things. Yes, they certainly require more supervision, as any smaller dog would.

I love my small to standard chi's sizes and that's why I got them. When I wanted a 10 pound dog, I got Cooper. It doesn't really matter how they started way back when, in my opinion, because lots of things change gradually over time. Heck, think about what they wanted our Mom's and Grandma's to gain when they were pregnant. My Mom's Dr. told her no more than 16 to 18 lbs. Pregnant women dieted back than to not gain too much weight. That being said, if there is ever a change in the breed standard, I hope the change is slight.

It would be sad for quality breeders, who have been breeding these small, healthy, delightful dogs for years to suddenly adhere to a bigger "standard". I'm not saying 2 or 3 lbs. is "normal" at all. That's definitely on the small scale but come on, we change the standard and all of a sudden there are 15 pound and bigger chi's out there because all dogs seem to get bigger in breeding with their being so many breeders out there that don't breed to adhere to the standard or better the breed.

Sure, there's always that pup or two in the litter that ends up bigger or smaller. That's just genes. Happens in humans also. That's why those pups should be sold on a "pet" registration only and SHOULD NOT BE BRED. Just my opinion, but I would be very sad to have all chi's being 6 and 7 lbs. and bigger. I got mine because I wanted 4 and 5 lbs. dogs!!! 

This is strictly my opinion and I hope that I don't offend anybody. I love hearing everybody's take on this and I adore every chi in every shape and size. What we want for our households and lifestyles personally doesn't mean we don't love all these wonderful chihuahua's. Our darling chihuahua breed is meant to be small and sassy and smart and charming just the way it is. If you don't want a "little" then go for the bigger end of the spectrum. There's plenty out there of both!!! Believe me, I got my little ones knowing right about where they would end up and I adore their size. I've never once been offended by anyone saying "oh, I would never want a dog that small". That's why I'm not sure why people with bigger chi's get upset when people comment that they are bigger chi's. 

There's a ton of choices out there for everybody but changing the breed standard, in my opinion, won't and shouldn't happen. In twenty years of breeding, my breeder and several other breeders I've talked with this about say that guessing size is one of the hardest things to do and it's always what people want to know with chi's. Why??? Because they are a small breed and that's why people want them. If somebody comes to her and wants a "super" small, she tells them it probably won't happen and if it does, it's a fluke. LOL. Two smaller parents can throw a big pup and two standard parents can throw a small pup. My 3 lb. Lily's parents are 5 lbs. (mom) and 4 lbs. (dad). She also knows that she won't end up with a well "over standard" pup unless it's a fluke. She can pretty much assure people that their pup will be within standard but there is never an actual guarantee as nature plays a role in this, obviously. 

As far as the "idiots" out there breeding their 3 lb. dogs for "teacups" and all that crap, shame on them. They are surely compromising the dog's health, not to mention the puppies and simply trying to make money. And YES, I've seen a pregnant 3 lb. chihuahua. It is possible and it does happen. It's quite sad, they need c-sections and only have one or two pups. 

If, in fact, you end up with a "tiny" out of a normal size Mom and Dad, chances are their genetics and health are good and you just got one on the smaller side. Same with if you end up with a "bigger" one out of standard size parents. It surely does happen but certainly shouldn't be considered the norm. 

Each and every breed has their own set of standards and should be adhered to and respected, in my opinion. I love chi's of all shapes and sizes. I prefer them to be within standard for me because I have so darn many and I love to take them with me!!! LOL!!!

Okay, thanks for listening to all my rambling chi friends.


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## rubia (Jul 3, 2008)

I didn't even think of this because we have had responses about healthy chi-s. I do think that it is unhealthy to have an overweight chi--not a larger size--but over the weight he should be. Many of us have strong muscular little dogs--their weight may be more than their delicate counterparts--but thatis not what I am refering to now.

Chi-s I think are a breed which can easily put on extra weight if the owners aren't careful with feeeding and such.

So yes there is a situation where it isn't good to have a big chi--and that is if you have a fat chi. It can be dangerous to the pups health.

At least this is what I tell mine when he is looking for more food


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## Tracilea (Jul 27, 2009)

I agree that they shouldn't change it suddenly and make it so they get huge. Obviously small chi's appeal to me as I love my lil 3.5 pound Woo Boy! lol And I do want a small girl. I was just talking about silly people who are TRYING to breed smaller and causing health problems with the dogs. And I just wonder of the standard was a slight bit bigger like maybe 4 to 7 pounds then maybe it wouldn't be such a quest for them to breed the 2 and 3 pound pups. Just a thought


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## OurCheekyChihuahuas (Nov 18, 2009)

Wow loads has happened on here its nice to read so many varied opinions and no arguemnts eitehr!  See an average Chi to me is 5/6lbs i have Fifi & HOpe who are around 5lbs Hope being a bit more slender then Fifi and Tiny who weighs just under 4lbs and the same with Kiki although she is very short and cobby *cough* fat lol Im not breeding to smaller the bred im trying to keep them within the breed description and i do agree it is wrong how certain people are trying to breed smaller chis i would hate to have a Chi smaller then 3lbs if that even possible! lol But hey people who breed them are only being helped out by the people who buy them ...


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## Yoshismom (Jul 6, 2005)

IMO, it is a Toy Breed and they should stick with the standard. As said above if you want a larger Toy Breed then their are other breeds out there for you. There is nothing we can do about poor breeding and it is happening with all breeds as well as breeding tinier versions of breeds. I am seeing tiny Shelties, Australian Cattle Dogs, Huskies, etc... It seems that breeders just decide to go out and change the rule's so they can start a new breed or new version of the breed? I think we have breed standards set in place for a reason and I like that we have some tinier breeds (standard Chihuahua) to choose from for those of us that prefer a smaller dogs 

I am not implying at all that a larger out of standard Chi is a bad thing, if that is what you want and like but there are a lot of unsuspecting buyers out there that are looking for a standard Chi and end up with a larger one and sometimes that ends up with a Chi being in an animal shelter or rescue (dont get me started on those irresponsible people that do not need dogs). If Yoshi would have ended up 30 lbs my feelings wouldnt have changed at all. You also have to take into consideration what poor breeding does to health and conformation. We struggle with Yoshi's harnesses as he has very bowed legs in the front that come out funny and cause anything like that to rub on him :-( His back legs are so straight that it looks as though it could be a bird leg, I am sure he will have trouble with those legs as he gets older :-( If breeder's would breed to standard and were made to do so then we wouldnt run into all of these issues, like dogs being born without legs or Hydro, etc... Just my take on things ;-)

I will have to share a pic of Yoshi's back legs when I get a chance to take one..I think you will be shocked :-( They make him walk funny to.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Just to clarify something in my post. When I mentioned "changing the standard." I'm not talking about drastically. Just a tad would reflect more of what we are seeing as the "standard" today. I also decided on a Chi for a small dog. I won’t be dishonest and say that if my Chi’s would have ended up 10 lb. dogs that I wouldn’t have been, what’s the right word here? Not disappointed, but that’s the only word I can think of. I would love them just the same, but I wasn’t looking for a 10 lb. dog. But if they changed it to 3 to 7 lbs. as the standard, it would more closely reflect the “average” sized Chi these days. I don’t think by changing it that much it would make anything any worse than it already is as far as breeding goes. I’m not sure that it would even make it better. People want 2 lb. dogs, so the madness will continue no matter what the breed standard is. It also isn’t going to change the genetic end of it either. Nor will it change that even show breeders get so many pet quality pups. Over sized, bad bites, roach backs, etc., etc., etc. 

I guess from my perspective, it just makes no sense to have the standard including 2/3 lb. Chi’s. Most of them that end up that weight *at full growth* by far would qualify for showing. I personally have never seen one that size not have something “quirky” about them. Whether it be their teeth/bite being a mess, tongues hanging out of their mouth, roach backed, etc. 

Anyway, like I also mentioned, breeders need to take into account the whole standard, not just parts of it. And I’m sure my opinion won’t ever come close to changing anything. So no worries there. :lol: I just can’t get over how much difference there was in Chi’s from way back, and what they are now. So at some point someone did decide to change things. Was it for the better? I’m not so sure. Just some thoughts.


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## Chiboymom (Jul 8, 2009)

Very interesting thread. Marie, I think Lola is wonderful just the way she is. Draco is over 7 pounds and I think he is very small though "out of standard" I was never interested in breeding so his size is a benefit for me, he is still very much a lap dog, but big enough that I don't freak out if someone wants to hold him or other dogs want to horseplay. As Chi owners (slaves..lol) we have such a variety of size and color to choose from...This is a very good thing.


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## MChis (Oct 13, 2009)

I continue to find it so amusing many people (general - not finger pointing) are so particular with breeding in todays "standard" yet obviously *someone* decided to change the original look of the Chi to begin with, to get it to look like the "standard" Chi today. (sorry, that was a mouth full!) I just wonder, what makes that *someone* any different than the people breeding for the old look (long nose, larger size, even floppy ears) which they may find more appealing than todays standard? Especially since the breed was basically changed to a dog with more health problems? They certainly weren't looking to "better the breed" in a health conscious kind of way...kwim?

I'm not for/against either I love the look of dogs with todays "standard" but I also love the idea of the bigger Chi's that allow families with smaller children have the breed as well.

I do think it would be wise to change the weight in the standard a bit but of course that won't happen unless whoever is "in charge" of the kennel clubs see fit. It is definitely an interesting topic though....


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## lynx8456 (Feb 26, 2009)

Jasper is 12 lbs+ has a very large bone
structure and Hannah is 5lbs w/a small frame. Big or small I still 
love them both and think they are cute as can be. 
As long as your chi is healthy and the vet is not
worried I wouldn't be too concerned.


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## ahra1284 (Sep 3, 2008)

of course there's nothing wrong with a bigger chi, nothing could change the way we love our babies especially size! I have one of each, Bam is weighing in at around 8-8.5lbs these days, and lucy is about 3.8lbs at the moment. Bam was my first chi - and i got him in a weak moment at a pet store (ahhhh) when i knew nothing about chis, i just saw him and i had to have him. then i fell in love with the breed, and carefully searched for my next chi, and she happened to be a small chi. i love them both equally and each have their own advantages to their size and I love that I have one of each. 

Personally, I wouldn't breed a larger Chi either. I think bigger chis are adorable, i have one myself! but if we keep breeding away from the standard, does that still make that a chi? If people wanted larger dogs that felt more "safe" to handle, I would recommend a different breed of dogs, not a modified version of the standard chi. thats just my opinion - but thrust ANY chi in my direction you know i'd be flush with happiness! Whether its a 2lb tiny or a 11lb giant!


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## FBRaRrN (May 1, 2006)

My smallest chi is 5and a half pounds my biggest one is 12pounds.So most of mine are big they are Freckles 7lbs,Radar 10lbs,Rascal 11lbs,Boo 10-11lbs Harry 7lbs and Nomo is the smallest at 5 and a half pounds.


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## Ivy's mom (Feb 15, 2008)

The thing that I don't get, when I was a child the standards in chi's say 40 yrs ago was totally a cobby body chi, and I mean very cobby. They were never slim, but very stalky and beefy. Not like you are seeing today. Not even what i see in show dogs at all now. Soooo.....when did those standards change. I know they still have a tad of a cobby body, but just not like it was many years ago.

LOri


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

Ok - this is very interesting. This is 2009 video from the Westminster Dog Show, one of the most prestigious shows in the USA. Similar to Crufts. ALL these Chihuahua's are breed champions. These are nationally ranked dogs that have been invited to participate based on their ranking in the breed and how many dogs they have beaten. So truly... these are the BEST of BREED in both varieties.

Here are the long coats ...

http://video.westminsterkennelclub.org/player/?id=1006741

Here are the short coats ...

http://video.westminsterkennelclub.org/player/?id=1006422

I find that these dogs all resemble each other. They could have been cut from the same cookie cutter, so to speak. Why? Because they meet the breed standard for what a Chihuahua should look like.

Take a look at the best dogs in our breed!!


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## TinyGiant (Jan 20, 2010)

beautiful! wooooot! I saw a merle long coat!


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## rocky scotland (Jun 15, 2008)

Ohhhh great video, I love that cobby, study look and the way they trot, did I mention I LOVE chihuahuas LOL!

Wow they all look the same!


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## Chiboymom (Jul 8, 2009)

Brodysmom said:


> I find that these dogs all resemble each other. They could have been cut from the same cookie cutter, so to speak. Why? Because they meet the breed standard for what a Chihuahua should look like.
> 
> Take a look at the best dogs in our breed!!


I really enjoyed looking at the video clip, I watched the short hair, will view the long hair later. Very enjoyable. Thanks for Linking this.


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## Tracilea (Jul 27, 2009)

Woah NELLY!! I watched only about half of the video because I am short for time , but I am confused? These dogs look big to me, bigger then Luna, much more stocky. Maybe i am just confused because Willy is so small, FAR smaller then these dogs, plus Willys back curves more up rather then going straight and he is just so darned skinny lol
Luna looks more like these chi's body wise except the short muzzles and Luna's thicker paws. Seeing these dogs walking along side their owners and seeing them up on that table in relation to the size of these people, to me doesn't make Luna look so big after all?


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## Ivy's mom (Feb 15, 2008)

Ahhhhh......haven't had a chance to view the LC but the SC were just stunning!!!! I would think around the 4-5 lb range

Lori


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## Aquarius (May 8, 2009)

Biggles is a big one  all the more to hug - plus he's great for walking, hiking etc - my other two littlies love walking as well, but Biggles is the big man here!!

Loved the videos of the long coats and short coats - lol they are not big!!!!!!! I reckon about 4lbs ish.


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## rcj1095 (Mar 4, 2009)

Tracy, AMEN!!! Now those are chihuahua's. I watch the westminster show every chance I get. Beautiful, perfect examples of our amazing breed. I'll be viewing them more than once. Thank you for posting them. They are probably between 4 and 6 pounds Tracilea. They always look bigger than what they actually are. They are older than pups also!!!

Perfect Angels!!!


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

Tracilea - they cannot be more than 6 pounds tops as that is the standard. These are CHAMPIONS. The BEST in the breed. Most of them are 4-5 pounds. They certainly are not large or oversized.


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## rubia (Jul 3, 2008)

Tracy..thanks for the link...I loved watching these..it is one thing to watch your own walking around the place it such a joy to see all of those lovely dogs in one place.


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## Ivy's mom (Feb 15, 2008)

Brodysmom said:


> Tracilea - they cannot be more than 6 pounds tops as that is the standard. These are CHAMPIONS. The BEST in the breed. Most of them are 4-5 pounds. They certainly are not large or oversized.


For sure....very small. I figured 4-5 as well, and this is only because I can compare Ivy and Fern which both are 3 lbs and is a teenie bit smaller than these dogs. The just seem to be more rounded which I like in a chi. Not thin and hollow in the tummy. These dogs don't look like pups either. I'm sure they are all done growing. Can you believe Ivy has FINALLY filled out more and looks soo much better now. Maybe it comes a bit with age to, but now she looks like a healthy little girl. I never thought she would bulk up, but she has 

Lori


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## Yoshismom (Jul 6, 2005)

Tracilea said:


> Woah NELLY!! I watched only about half of the video because I am short for time , but I am confused? These dogs look big to me, bigger then Luna, much more stocky. Maybe i am just confused because Willy is so small, FAR smaller then these dogs, plus Willys back curves more up rather then going straight and he is just so darned skinny lol
> Luna looks more like these chi's body wise except the short muzzles and Luna's thicker paws. Seeing these dogs walking along side their owners and seeing them up on that table in relation to the size of these people, to me doesn't make Luna look so big after all?


Your Luna is 5 months old and 7lbs so that would make her only about 1 lb off from the standard you are seeing there in reality. She has much more growing to do so she may very well be the same size as the Chi's you are viewing but she should get much bigger by maturity. I will try to find a video of mine that show 6 month olds in the ring so you can see the differrence


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## TinyGiant (Jan 20, 2010)

Yoshismom said:


> Your Luna is 5 months old and 7lbs so that would make her only about 1 lb off from the standard you are seeing there in reality. She has much more growing to do so she may very well be the same size as the Chi's you are viewing but she should get much bigger by maturity. I will try to find a video of mine that show 6 month olds in the ring so you can see the differrence


I would love to see 6 month olds in the ring. :hello1:


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## Bella Luna (Jan 15, 2010)

Wow..there really are a ton of different looking Chihuahuas today!! Short muzzles, long muzzles, "deer face", apple head, long, cobby, etc. And I noticed that those had thicker necks..Bella's is so skinny! maybe because she is still so young?? I don't know!

They are gorgeous though


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Awesome video! Gorgeous Chi's! I love to see their prance. But I also have to say that those Chi's do look very big and stocky. Like mini bull dogs. :lol:


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## Ivy's mom (Feb 15, 2008)

TLI said:


> Awesome video! Gorgeous Chi's! I love to see their prance. But I also have to say that those Chi's do look very big and stocky. Like mini bull dogs. :lol:


Hee hee..... Teresa, compared to your chiwi's and Ivy and Fern they are big, but I think because these are what I see to be more cobby, even though ours aren't super leggy, i think ours fall somewhere inbetween. People still think Ivy and Fern are puppys. They always think I'm joking. When Fern just got spayed even the vet said she looked smaller than 3 lbs. They were shocked. I think her and Ivy have alot of muscle rofl!!!!

Lori


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## Ivy's mom (Feb 15, 2008)

Bella Luna said:


> Wow..there really are a ton of different looking Chihuahuas today!! Short muzzles, long muzzles, "deer face", apple head, long, cobby, etc. And I noticed that those had thicker necks..Bella's is so skinny! maybe because she is still so young?? I don't know!
> 
> They are gorgeous though


It's the cobby in them. They have that thicker neck. Willow has it since she is a cobby, and Fern has a little thicker neck, but Ivy has a tiny tiny neck.

Lori


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## Yoshismom (Jul 6, 2005)

Imo, there is a standard now so no matter what it was it is set again today and should be followed...just my two cents worth. Without some sort of standard then the breed is all over the place. They worked for this standard for ages and this is what they settled with and I am sure it will change a bit here and there.

Still with that being said if you dont watch lines and stick to standard then you come up with problems like my Yoshi has. Below are the pictures I said I would share...
This first picture shows a bit of what I am saying about the bowed front legs. It is not as apparent in the picture but in day to day and the way he walks and stands you can really see it. His legs protrude on both sides and watch the way his legs turn in funny.








This picture shows how straight the leg can actually make itself.









This picture shows him standing on the leg with that straight and how flat footed he is..Bless him.


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## Yoshismom (Jul 6, 2005)

Here is a link to the Illustrated standard in case anyone is interested 
http://www.chihuahuaclubofamerica.com/NEW TRANSFER/PDFFILES/Illustrated Standard.pdf


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## KayC (May 3, 2005)

Tracy, Thanks for posting the videos. Michelle thanks for posting the photos and link. 

When I got Zoey I was hoping for a bit bigger cobbier chi, my Roxy was so small and fragile I wanted a more "sturdy" chi and I had no intention on breeding her. Zoey is a skinny tiny thing, but I love her just as well..


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## TinyGiant (Jan 20, 2010)

I think Zoey is so beautiful.


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## Ivy's mom (Feb 15, 2008)

Oh.....I just LOVE Zoey. How much does miss peanut weigh now.

Lori


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## KayC (May 3, 2005)

TinyGiant said:


> I think Zoey is so beautiful.


Thank You Gail, I think Pepper is adorable as well..




Ivy's mom said:


> Oh.....I just LOVE Zoey. How much does miss peanut weigh now.
> 
> Lori


Thank You Lori, You know I have always been a BIG fan of your gang. Zoey weighs 4lbs after dinner...


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## Tracilea (Jul 27, 2009)

oh I know they are standard and not past 6 pounds  I was just saying they look big compared to Willy. They look more Luna's size, as was pointed out too since she is just 1 pound over 6 pounds 
I think I just got used to Willys tiny skinny lil body, like Brody he has that slender body and not thicker bodies like the video. The video was awesome  Thanks for posting it. It gave me the idea too maybe to make a video of Willy and Luna walking lol I will see about enlisting my son to help me by recording us on our walk lol Might be a fun thread to start. Even though I will have to wait and watch videos on my hubbys comp as mine is far too old. I wonder how I got stuck with the old comp....:-/ lol


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## Tracilea (Jul 27, 2009)

PS, I was reading the other link posted....also a brillant link, and I found it interesting that it says its the weight that determines disqualification rather then size. It said that bigger dogs can weight less then a dog that seems small. It was interesting reading for sure!  Good link Yoshismom


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## Ivy's mom (Feb 15, 2008)

Zoey's Mom said:


> Thank You Gail, I think Pepper is adorable as well..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Heee hee...... Thanks girl. I just think Zoey is such a pretty, pretty baby. She is just such a girly little thing. Soooo feminine. I hear ya with the food. Ivy gets a round little tummy now after she eats lol!!!!

Lori


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## chloeschihuahau (Feb 7, 2010)

Tracilea said:


> I too love that Luna is bigger and more sturdier because I don't need another worry like I do for Willy. Poor lil chap slipped on some ice yesterday and scraped his stump. I had a bleeder on my hands and the little bum wouldn't leave his bandaging on  He is fine today though and has a wee lil scab
> 
> In my information gathering there is something i am curious about and I will soon do some research on it, I am wondering why and how the chi is so tiny. I wonder if THAT was somethng bred into them because 4 to 6 pounds is so tiny. I am wondering about all the problems with it from birthing difficulties to hypoglastemia. Maybe they have been bred TOO small to suit someones fancy (I mean through history not now in present time). I have heard of other breeds being bred into a whole world of problems, shorter muzzles giving eye and breathing probs (in other breeds not chi's). How far is too far right?


Thats cute poor little willy, he sounds mischievous. :daisy:

and even if she is a little bigger it doesnt matter. she is still a chiihuahua and a very cute one at that !


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## Yoshismom (Jul 6, 2005)

Tracilea said:


> PS, I was reading the other link posted....also a brillant link, and I found it interesting that it says its the weight that determines disqualification rather then size. It said that bigger dogs can weight less then a dog that seems small. It was interesting reading for sure!  Good link Yoshismom


Yes we had a big conversation on this not to long ago and I made a thread where everyone gave their height and weight of their Chi and the posted a picture of them beside like pop cans, etc.... Check it out here ;-)
http://www.chihuahua-people.com/showthread.php?t=39008&highlight=comparison+thread


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## TinyGiant (Jan 20, 2010)

Yoshismom said:


> Yes we had a big conversation on this not to long ago and I made a thread where everyone gave their height and weight of their Chi and the posted a picture of them beside like pop cans, etc.... Check it out here ;-)
> http://www.chihuahua-people.com/showthread.php?t=39008&highlight=comparison+thread


That is an awesome idea!


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## Tracilea (Jul 27, 2009)

LOL Yoshismom, i did see that thread and I had put pics of Willy and Luna next to pop cans. Though I did not add height and stuff because I don't know how exactly to measure and I'm not sure if I have a measuring tape I could use. I will have to see about getting one just to see. What would I use, one in a sewing kit?


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## MarieUkxx (May 19, 2009)

It's interesting reading everyone's opinions. I think in between size like Cookie is best, not too tiny and not too big. Lola is way to big for her breed but I love her. If I'm totally honest I'd like her to have been smaller. Exactly how she is but smaller lol. I'll post a piccy of her next to a pop can so you guys can see better. She's a big un lol. 

Cookie's breeder bred a lot of champions and his dad was a winner at crufts. She was well known back in the day. He's what I'd call a typical looking Chi. With benny and Lola I went for personality over looks and I wasn't disappointed and when I get another Chi one day I'll go for personality again, I wouldn't turn one down just because of it's size. I would prefer a perfect looking Chi with the perfect personality too but I just haven't seen any yet


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