# Jasper has been diagnosed w/Canine Epilepsy



## lynx8456 (Feb 26, 2009)

Our sweet boy Jasper, for a long time now has suffered from some "behavioral issues" that were thought to be a form of anxiety disorder, but lately things had gotten worse and a pattern had developed or some might say a "chain of events" that would frequently repeat itself. Recently, Jasper also started having some upset tummy issues and although they passed, Ralph and I both thought it was time for a check-up and a full blood chemistry panel. Jasper was a very good boy for all of this! Despite the issues he has endured and his dislike for the vet he is no worse for wear. His blood work came back very good other than 1 Liver enzyme level being a bit high (ALT was 149)and 2 enzyme levels being off with his pancreas (1 was high and 1 was low). Organ functions were all excellent. All 3 levels being off may be due to the fact that Jasper had eaten with-in 12hrs of the blood work. Bottom line diagnosis is that Jasper is suffering from what is known as a canine form of Epilepsy. In his case he has partial focal seizures (meaning he DOES NOT violently convulse, salavate or loose unconsciousness), but his behavior does become altered/erratic, he compulsively air licks, shakes, becomes slightly disorientated, hunches, hides and goes through a few other symptoms in a pattern. It happens in 3 stages, so we know when it is about to happen, we see it occur and we know when it is passing (to put it in basic terms). At this point he is on 16.2mgs of phenobarbital twice a day (or every 12 hrs like clock work). It will take about 7-10 days to take effect, and for the 1st 3-5 days there has been a few side effects that should soon pass. We have been and will continue to keep written track of any changes we observe and take Jasper back to the vets in 30 days to determine if he is getting the correct dose of Phenobarbital. The goal is to keep Jasper in therapeutic range. We will also retest the liver and pancreas enzyme levels to make sure they are not too high or too low. Both tests will be done every month until Jasper stabilizes, then the med test will be done every 30 days and the enzymes will be done every 60/90 days if the levels maintain at a certain numbers. ***The next time the test is done for the Pheno. barb. it will be 4-6 hrs after Jasper has taken it> per FDA guidelines. The liver and enzymes test will be done at the same time. Our vet recommended not with holding food, so the ALT level of 149 will be used as a guideline. 

There is a high risk of long term issues with the use of PB. so again the blood work will be necessary every 30 days , but there is also another drug called Potassium Bromide (KBr) that epileptic dog owners have had very good results with. This drug does not cause issues with the liver, but it can take up to 3-4 months to work. Thus, we have to stick with what Jasper is on now and perhaps in time ween him off the PB and gradually introduce the KBr into his therapeutic drug program. KBr also requires blood level checks monthly , but in the long term it might be a less risky alternative for him. 

At this point, Jasper is doing relatively well on the PB although he does drink a lot more water which of course leads to frequent urination and he is sleeping more, but over all there is some improvement in him already. ***Not much but some...it has only been 6 days on the med. 

The only other thing we plan on going over with out vet in terms of treatment is to have a full thyroid test done to make sure Jasper does not have Low Thyroid or Hypothyroidism because both can cause seizures if left untreated. What has caused the Epilepsy we will probably never know. Our objective now is just to treat it and help him through any seizures as best we can. Of course lots and lots of love along with extra amounts of TLC and prayers will be the order of the day for our Jasper 

I am wondering if anyone here has ever owned an dog with epilepsy and if so maybe he/she can share some info or experience. Mommy,daddy, Moose and Ginger are taking excellent care of him but please send some positive vibes, thoughts and prayers to Jasper. 

Jasper waiting in the car outside the vets office:









Jasper saying OMG daddy don't let the bad man take blood from me:









After the vets he got a nice walk and a bit of ice cream. You can see he was very happy about it!


----------



## pupluv168 (Mar 7, 2012)

I am so sorry hun. My previous chi had epilepsy- grand mal seizures. It was horrible to watch. He was on phenobarbital for nearly a year before my mom decided she didn't want to risk his liver, etc. 

With Max, he had to get blood drawn every 30 days, then after a few months every 60 days to check his liver function and other organ function. His epilepsy symptoms were controlled, but he did experience some side effects from the pheno. 

His was thirsty a lot. We always made sure he had clean, fresh, COLD water. He got hot easily and was heat sensitive so he couldn't really do long walks. Other than that he was basically okay. When we took him off of it, he had 1 or 2 seizures a year. For us it wasn't worth the side effects. He was fine after his seizures and was in perfect health other than that and LP. 

My sister has severe epilepsy and is on high doses of meds. I see what it's done to her. None of Max's side effects were that bad, thank goodness. 

I'm sure Jasper will be okay. Please keep us updated. Hugs to you all. 


Sent from my iPhone using PetGuide


----------



## krbshappy71 (Oct 1, 2012)

Im sorry you are going through this!

My friend's Sheltie has epilepsy; he takes a pill twice a day every day at the same time each day but otherwise is fine. She has someone pop into the house if for ANY reason she cannot make the exact time for the pill, she's very diligent about it and he hasn't had a seizure for years now. He is 5 yrs old.


Sent from my iPhone using PG Free I LOVE THIS FORUM!


----------



## Aquarius (May 8, 2009)

I'm sorry to hear that Laura.

Our last dog Ringo was a Cavalier King Charles, the very first day we got him my daughter came running into me that Ringo had lost the power of his back legs, after about 10 minutes he was fine, but I rushed him to the vet convinced that maybe he'd been dropped - but the vet couldn't find anything wrong with him - this continued happening over a year or so, but again by the time I'd get him to the vet he'd be fine.

Eventually the vet referred him to a vet hospital where they scanned and did all kinds of tests, which came back with a diagnosis of epilepsy. He was prescribed Phenobarbital. However over time his symptoms changed to all four of his limbs flailing and his eyes darting all over the place - but he did see to keep conscious all the time - gradually over the years, his Phenobarbital was increased and increased but he never had any kind of tests done - this all started about 16 or 17 years ago, I didn't know better and the vets never suggested it. Even on the Phenobarbital he always had fits, but maybe just 4 or 5 bad ones a year and a few mild ones.

At the age of 5 he got a heart murmur which is so common in Cavaliers - so every day he took his Phenobarbital and heart medication - he did sleep a lot, which I thought was normal until I got these 3 pups and realised they don't sleep half as much as he did.

But despite his epilepsy and heart issues, all round he was a happy, loyal, gentle and funny dog right up until he died at 12.5 years which is really good for a Cavalier, especially as he had all his issues from such a young age.

Whenever we went away we left him with a lovely dog minder, who minds 4 or 5 dogs in her home - we always told her to never leave Ringo on his own with the other dogs, I was fearful as to what their reaction to Ringo fitting would be - his fits would last about 15 minutes and could have been frightening to the other dogs. He was an only dog in our house.

I would be very hopeful that the diagnosis of epilepsy won't effect Jasper too much, you sound like you are totally on top of it, you are testing for things we never even thought of, considering other types of medicine and veterinary medicine is streets ahead of what it was when we had Ringo.

I wish you the best with Jasper


----------



## LostLakeLua (Sep 6, 2009)

Hello! Sorry to hear about Jasper's diagnosis but I'm sure he will adjust fine to being on meds. I used to work at a couple different vets offices for about 7+ years, and one of the things I did consistently was handle dogs for lab draws for PB levels when owners brought them in for their routine checks. It was tedious in the beginning no doubt for all of the blood work appointments, but once the vets can figure out the appropriate dose for him, he should be in the clear. Figuring out that correct dose for "maintenance" is the hardest part, so once that's over with you'll be able to see which symptoms still linger. Meanwhile just keep lots of water available (a fountain is great, like the ones they sell for cats, to encourage hydration) and offer enough potty breaks to compensate for his increased fluids. 
My "future" brother in law has a Chihuahua named Zip who is also epileptic. He had frequent seizures, and a few here and there during the 'adjustment' period of the meds, but now that he's on a regular dose he is symptom free. =) 
I wish you all the best, Laura, and keep us posted on sweet Jasper!! <3


----------



## Smith (Jun 7, 2010)

I owed a dog with idiopathic epilepsy and have fostered several others (I work with Italian Greyhound Rescue, and epilepsy is, unfortunately, one of the more common health problem in the breed). Phoebe, the IG I owned, used to have partial seizures every 6-8 weeks. She would wobble and sway for 5-10 minutes, then throw up and nap hard for a couple hours. Because the seizures were less than once a month, we opted not to use medication. However, when I transitioned everyone to raw feeding, her seizures reduced from one every 6-8 weeks to one every 12-18 months. 

Another dog, a foster IG named Pepper, also had seizures. He came to me on phenobarbital, but blood tests showed his liver values were not great (he was 10), so we decided to try and wean him off the pheno and switch him to KBr. We did both at the same time, though we had to play with the KBr dose, because I found, after using it for about 2 months, he lost a lot of mobility in his back end and his legs would give out on him. Reading more about KBr, I guess this is an uncommon side effect that can occur, and when we reduced the amount of KBr he was getting, his mobility returned.


----------



## woodard2009 (Aug 4, 2010)

Awe! Poor baby Jasper!! It sure sounds like you've got everything under control!! Way to go mommy & daddy!! Sending healing prayers your way! Don't have no experience with epilepsy. Sorry.


----------



## nabi (Nov 25, 2004)

Laura ...I am so sorry to hear about Jaspars diagnoses....I pray the PB is effective and his liver enzymes remain within an acceptable range.....maybe in a few months you will be able to try the KBr....I know you and Ralph will be working closely with your DVM....he looks so happy in the last 2 pics..he knew he was going to get a treat for being such a brave boy.....hugs to him from the girls....


----------



## Angel1210 (Mar 14, 2011)

From reading the posts, it seems like things look good for Jasper! But it is still a little frightening.

I had a dog once that had seizures. She convulsed and lost control of all body functions. She was a larger dog, (around 50lbs). After being on the PB for a time, the seizures stopped. 

I hope all goes well with Jasper.


----------



## ~LS~ (Oct 29, 2011)

BIG hugs for Jasper, I'm sending lots of positive, healing vibes. 
He is a lucky boy to have you Laura, and your hubby of course.
You are doing a wonderful job, I wish your whole family good health.
I don't have much experience with epilepsy, but I want you to know
I care very much about you and your pups and am here for support. Hugs.


----------



## jesuschick (Dec 5, 2010)

Sweet little guy!

I sure pray that the medication makes a positive difference. So sorry that he-and you-are having to deal with this.


----------



## rubia (Jul 3, 2008)

Sorry about all of it Laura. I know how well you and Ralph care for your pups. Jasper's in good hands there. Will say a prayer that he is feeling well very soon. Hope that the medicine is helpful.


----------



## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

I read your post the other day  poor guy! but he's lucky to have you guys you take such wonderful care of your dogs! Hopefully the meds will agree with him and not have too many side effects for him.


----------



## KrystalLeigh (Aug 17, 2011)

I haven't had any experience with canine epilepsy, but I just wanted to say that I'm thinking about your sweet little guy! It sounds like things will be under control, and I hope that you're able to find a solution that works for his epilepsy and his health. Sending positive thoughts your way!


----------



## susan davis (Mar 25, 2011)

I have a dog with alot of the same issues that was diagnosed by a canine neurologist. The diagnosis was that of exclusion. She had EVERY test imaginable. $3800 worth!!! She is also on phenobarbital. She also has liver issues from the pheno. She is only 4 yrs old. Her symptoms are air biting, biting herself for non existant fleas, and 'panic attacks where she runs pel mel away from whatever is chasing her (nothing) She looks over her shoulder and runs to me. The pheno has stopped that. The airbiting is better but still occurs only in my lap!! (This is the pup from the 'wonderful breeder' (NOT) who was secretary of the national chihuahua club! He has been since accused of breeding bitches who have this same condition!) She is 4 yrs old now.


----------



## lynx8456 (Feb 26, 2009)

Thank you everyone for the replies and kind words. Jasper is going through a VERY rough time right now. It has only been 7 days on the medication and it is helping a bit , but the side effects are a bit tough for him. Yesterday, he urinated himself while he was sleeping and through out the night last night he had several seizure symptoms that would not let up. We have spoken to to the vet and he suggested we reduce Jasper down to 1/2 the dosage of the Pheno. Barb. to help with the urination and excessive drinking ...he told us it that it will still help with the seizures. I have also scheduled a full thyroid panel to be done on Monday to rule out any issues. If anything is found of course we will treat that...it is possible that if he has Hypothyroidism it could cause some of the seizures, his slow metabolism and the weight that we can not get off him. 

I also want to thank you ladies for sharing your stories about your expierences with epileptic dogs. The info really helps more than you know. A lot of what was described gives me reassurance that we have a correct diagnosis and that the treatment is the right thing to do. Now all Jasper, Ralph and I need is the strength, guidance, and prayers to get through this awful time.


----------



## KayC (May 3, 2005)

Laura, so sorry about Jasper's diagnosis. I'm glad you are on top of things for him. Hope the decrease in his dose helps with the side affects and still can keep his seizures under control. Poor Jasper. Will sends lots of hugs and puppy licks your way xxxx


----------



## nabi (Nov 25, 2004)

Just wondering how Jasper is doing now with his lower PB dosing ? Hugs to him from the girls ...


----------



## lynx8456 (Feb 26, 2009)

nabi said:


> Just wondering how Jasper is doing now with his lower PB dosing ? Hugs to him from the girls ...


Thank You for asking Kathleen
We got the thyroid test results back and they came out good. T3 level was 105 (acceptable range is 50-200) and the T4 was 3 on a scale of 1-5. So all in all Jasper's were excellent. In a way I am totally relieved , but the down side is that we still do not know what is causing all of Jasper's mild seizures and other symptoms that have been ailing him. After a very bad 10 days on the PB (and even a reduced dosage at 1 point)the vet told us to take Jasper off of it for a few days and see how he responds. It does allow for the symptoms to continue and maybe worsen , but the effects of the medication seemed worse. We knew there would be side effects, but most dogs over come them after 3-5 days where Jasper only got worse. His bladder was working over time, he actually slept through having to go potty and urinated himself, he was dopey acting, disorientated at times and he seemed really unsure of his surroundings and more scared at times then he was during a mild seizure with out the medication. So at this point we will observe how he is with out the medication for the next 72 hrs and look for any signs or triggers that cause his symptoms and try to keep track of how many mild seizures he has. Also monitoring his urinary out put and a few other things. Our vet is not completely convinced that Jasper can be with out the PB or some sort of other treatment. We will also still be doing the full blood panel for the liver and pancreas enzyme levels to make sure there are no secondary issues. So, that is all for now. I will post more updates when we know more.
*Hugs from Jasper,Moose and Ginger*


----------



## nabi (Nov 25, 2004)

I hope Jasper does all right without the PB...its no good having him so groggy thats for sure...puts him at risk for all kinds of injuries etc....I'm sure your DVM is on top of things and of course you and Ralph will be monitoring closely.....


----------



## susan davis (Mar 25, 2011)

I am waiting for a holistic treatment for Emmie. I cannot believe that she is having seizures; they are just back to back licking and biting air and her paws. I can interrupt them by touching her muzzle. She just gets off my lap, and goes and continues this in the chair next to mine.! Doesn't seem to bother her at all!! The panic attacks are the only reason I am continuing the PB. That is not a problem when she takes it. She has no external signs of the PB. (phenobarbital) the liver tests are out of whack though. Three of the liver tests, including the bile acid tests are abnormal, three are normal?


----------



## Pookypeds (Jun 20, 2006)

Oh no Laura, I'm sorry you and Jasper have to go through this! I do hope you and your vet can find the medication and in the right amount that will help him! You guys are in my prayers!


----------



## Nancy (Feb 4, 2009)

Sorry to hear that your pup was having such bad side effects from the PB....My Jose has been having seizures since he was 2 he is 5 now and on PB (15mgsx2) since May 2011...He was having seizures almost weekly so I finally had to give in to the meds for him...I was scared of liver troubles as well..but its been almost 18 months and he has had only 3 break thru seizures...I have his blood tested every 4 to 6 months and its always been with the normal ranges...I hope all works out for u...there is a yahoo group that was very helpful to me when Jose started talking his meds...they calmed me down...Good Luck

Nancy and Jose


----------



## lynx8456 (Feb 26, 2009)

Here is the update about Jasper's visit to the vet's this week. He did do well at the vet yesterday and we did have the long awaited second round of tests done. The Phenobarbital (PB) test results will not be back until Monday, but as promised our vet called us last night with the liver panel results. On the good side 8 of the numbers came back good and the ALT level came down from 179 to 107. Normally, we would call this a very good improvement , however such a drop in a month's time could be a sign of something more going on. Meaning either the slight tweaks in Jasper's diet had a positive effect or that Jasper's liver might have gone through an "episode" of sorts prior to the last test and has since recovered (it can take 3.5 weeks after a change or episode with-in a dog's liver for enzyme levels to recuperate). The not so good news is that Alkaline Phosphatase (AKLP) numbers rose from 173 to 299 which is very significant because the norm is 23-212. Obviously, this is of great concern. There are numerous reasons that this number may have gone up , but the obvious suspect seems to be that Jasper's liver is not breaking down the PB dosages properly which may explain the severe side effects he had when he was taking 16.2mgs twice a day. So for the last few weeks Jasper has been on 16.2mgs only (8mgs twice a day)...the side effects have been minimal, his seizure episodes have greatly reduced to manageable symptoms, and over all he is doing better & seems happier (except when he has a "flare" up). Anyway, our vet's suggestion was to give Jasper 1 Same tablet @ 400mgs per day to help improve circulation to Jasper's liver and in turn help it it break down the PB easier. It will also help improve his brain function (impaired by the epilepsy) and aid in his bone health. At this point we will await the PB test results and in 30 days run the full liver panel and PB tests again. We might also have a urine analysis done if the vet thinks it is necessary. In the mean time we monitor Jasper closely, update his journal daily and give thanks that our little boy is holding his own. We love him so very , very much. Thank You for everyone's love and support for Jasper. As always it means a lot and we are all very thankful for it.


----------



## Leeanne (Oct 25, 2012)

Sorry to hear that  I have no experience with epilepsy but would just like to say he is so gorgeous!


----------



## susan davis (Mar 25, 2011)

Just a note on the liver involvement with phenobarbital. The alkaline phosphotase test is VERY sensitive. You can all normal liver tests (Emmie's were normal but her AlkPhos test was 5500!!!!!!!!!!) The Bile Acid tests was only slightly high.) and have a high alkphos test. My Emmie has NO symptoms at all. Her panic attacks are controlled, but the air biting is still going along, but I can interrupt them. I just let her tell me how she's feeling. So far so good. February I will have them repeated.


----------



## nabi (Nov 25, 2004)

Laura...I am so glad to read this update..I often think of Jasper and hope everything is under control...it sounds like you have a very attentive DVM and he/she will keep a good eye on Jaspers liver function....it is so scary when things aren't right. Everybody including the DVM can say " don't worry "...but we just do that, worry, because we love them so....hugs to him from the girls ...
Happy Thanksgiving to you and Ralph....


----------



## lynx8456 (Feb 26, 2009)

Mini update: Last test came back: PB levels were good. So we are continuing to do 1/2 doses twice a day plus 1 Sam E supplement per day, to help his liver break down the phenobarbital. Jasper's seizures have been milder and his symptoms much more manageable. At this point he will be retested in 30 days for both the PB and Liver function plus the enzymes, but for now all is good and we are breathing a sigh of relief. We know we are not out of the woods yet, and the the liver enzyme levels will vary quite a bit with each re-test for a while due to the PB, but hopefully with the next round of blood work we will have a set of numbers that we can use as a basis for future tests. Fingers crossed on that. My hope is that Jasper remains stable as far as the epilepsy is concerned and that we can keep him on the low doses of pb because it is a tough drug for any dogs system especially with long term use. 

Jasper holding on to his daddy for dear life while awaiting his blood work to be done:







Could be daddy holding on to Jasper for dear life to....neither one does well at the vet's office.


----------

