# New Chi - very worried! (open fontanel)



## RelicDobes (Sep 23, 2009)

Hi all, 
I posted about a year ago saying I was looking at a little year old male, but he was not the right dog for me. I have been looking for a chi since then, and finally found a perfect little fit! He was a rescue, a walking skeleton (I will get pictures soon). He is 3.9 lbs and 7 1/2 months old. 

anyway, he went to the vet today to be vetted and the vet gave him shots, did heartworm test, scheduled his neuter and gave him a one over. While looking him over she discovered he had an open fontanel. Has anyone had experience with this? I am worried about it. She said to be very careful with him while is is closing and to watch him because it might close and then there might not be enough room for his brain and he will become aggressive to the point of having to be put down. any experience with that situation????? 

I am very worried about my boy, I have only had him for 2 days, but I am very attached to him. I have a doberman in the house that is very careful with him but I don't want an accident to happen. should I keep them apart? 

thanks guys, I will get pics asap.


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## MChis (Oct 13, 2009)

Congrats on your new addition! It is very common for adult Chi's to have an open fontanel (molera) - as a matter of fact I believe it states it in the breed standard in the US!  Four of my Chi's have a small molera & are perfectly healthy. I guess it depends on the size of the molera as well...all of mine are relatively small. (smaller than a dime) 

I can't wait to see pics of your baby. Kudos to you for rescuing him!


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## flippedstars (Dec 16, 2009)

Two of my adult chis have open fontanels. It may never close. Bryco has about an inch long "stitch" that's 1/4" wide, it may or may not close. Oakley's got an open one the size of a dime that will not close. Its really not a big deal at all and used to be part of the standard!


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

Personally, I would find another vet. His information is wrong and outdated. An open fontanel certainly does not cause aggression. This would seriously erode my trust in him. He obviously does not know Chihuahuha's or just basic dog anatomy. An open molera is not a concern with a Chi. I would be concerned that he doesn't have any experience with small dogs. It sounds like your little guy will need some TLC and that should include a knowledgeable and up to date vet! Look around for someone more qualified. There's no excuse for his baseless and off the wall comments.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

I found this for you or anyone who is looking. Best thing to do is read up on Chihuahuas...

Dealing with Your Chihuahua's Health Issues - For Dummies

go down where it says Molera that is the soft spot you said you are worry about all chihuahuas have that and some may never close but will get smaller with age..

good luck


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## QUIGLEY'S MOM (Jan 12, 2010)

My 11 month old Chi has one as well. The vet's have told me it's large even for a Chi.


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## rache (Nov 10, 2009)

4 of my chis have an open fontanel. My girl pixie is nearly 9 months and hers is still huge, almost as wide as her head and about half an inch long. 

I would def find a more experienced vet. Try not to worry, just supervise any rough play. It shouldnt be anything to worry about x


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## cprcheetah (May 4, 2009)

I agree with Tracy, you need to find another vet, I have never heard of that and I have worked for a Vet for 20+ years. Zoey is my little 5 year old Chihuahua and she has an open Fontanel (Molera) which is pretty much 'normal' in chihuahuas, some close but a good majority of them do not. Zoey's is about the size of a quarter. She also has hydrocephalus (Which is NOT related to the open fontanel) her open fontanel actually is saving her life because she has excess pressure, so it relieves it, Zoey doesn't have an aggressive bone in her body...except if the cats sit on her and even then she just warns. I would look for another vet who is better versed in up to date things and has a lot of experience with chihuahuas.

Here is some information on it: http://www.chihuahuaclubofamerica.com/molera.htm


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Brodysmom said:


> Personally, I would find another vet. His information is wrong and outdated. An open fontanel certainly does not cause aggression. This would seriously erode my trust in him. He obviously does not know Chihuahuha's or just basic dog anatomy. An open molera is not a concern with a Chi. I would be concerned that he doesn't have any experience with small dogs. It sounds like your little guy will need some TLC and that should include a knowledgeable and up to date vet! Look around for someone more qualified. There's no excuse for his baseless and off the wall comments.


This! this and this!
This vet hasn't a clue!!!


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## RelicDobes (Sep 23, 2009)

thanks guys. I really do like this vet, I think she was just telling me all the things that could happen so I can watch for them. I understand that when it is open there is no aggression problems, but if it closes it could put pressure on their brain. I will just keep an eye on it and see how it goes. 

What do you think about playing with my doberman? Play between them is ALWAYS 100% supervised. He is pretty careful with him but sometimes will forget his size. 

I will get some pics soon, he is resting after his vet ordeal. He had a reaction to his vaccination and is pretty sore and sleepy after his benadryl. 

thanks for the reassurance!  

Bri and Axl


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## Guess (Sep 23, 2009)

There is no such thing as them getting aggression from their molera closing, creating pressure on the brain. LOL 

As a Dobe owner, you should have known right off the bat your vet has no idea what she's talking about. We've ALL heard the myth about Dobie's heads not growing any further, but their brain continues to which puts pressure on it and causes them to go schizo and attack.


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

RelicDobes said:


> thanks guys. I really do like this vet, I think she was just telling me all the things that could happen so I can watch for them. I understand that when it is open there is no aggression problems, but if it closes it could put pressure on their brain. I will just keep an eye on it and see how it goes.
> l


Once again, there is wrong information here. A closed molera will NOT put pressure on the brain. It may close, it may not, but if it closes - that doesn't mean that the brain will swell and cause problems. That information is NOT CORRECT. 

The ONLY condition that would be a concern with a closed molera would be hydrocephalus which causes swelling of the brain. Your puppy doesn't have hydrocephalus. Thus, it's fine if the molera closes.

Do you really want a vet that doesn't understand these basic concepts???

As for the vaccine reaction, I would NOT give any more vaccines. The next one could escalate to a fatality. If you want more information, search for vaccination info in the search bar at the top. It is a recurrent topic and one you should be fully versed on. Immunity studies are showing 7 years of immunity. You can do titers later if you are unsure if your pup is protected and has formed antibodies against disease.

I would probably be hesitant to recommend play between a doberman and a 3 pound puppy. It's an accident waiting to happen. I wouldn't keep them separate, but I would supervise any and ALL interactions. I would not encourage "play" at this stage.


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## woodard2009 (Aug 4, 2010)

I agree with everything everyone has said. IMO I probably wouldn't rush the vaccinations as this dog seems very malnurished & unhealthy. I would either spread them out quite a bit or hold of til he's stronger & healthy maybe 6-12 months. I would not let a Chi interact with a Doberman. I had a friend who had a Chi (My Chi's sister pup). The Chi was 3 years old between 5 1/2 to 6 1/2 lbs. My friend took in a medium size stray that was pretty aggressive at play. The two played together all the time. One morning my friend went to check on the chi & it was dead. This stray must have playfully tried to grab the Chi around the neck either puncturing or collapsing the trachea. Sad situation. These dogs are just too fragile to play with anything other than another Chi.


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## woodard2009 (Aug 4, 2010)

I just love this forum--Ever since I've joined I've learned something every single day. I had no idea about this fontanel thing & had it been me being told this by a vet--I would have been freakin too. I don't think my Chi has an open one. I can't feel one & about 1 1/2 ago I dropped something pretty heavy that hit her on the head & I think if she had an open one, it would have killed her.


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## Amandarose531 (Aug 9, 2010)

Pretty much what everyone else said, my girl had an open molera till she was at least a year old, i've noticed it's either extremely small or nonexistent anymore :]

I haven't really checked my boy but I haven't noticed one....not that he holds still long enough to find out....


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## RelicDobes (Sep 23, 2009)

thanks again for the info. Very informative. Actually dobermans can have a gland in their brain swell causing extreme aggression. that is not a myth. doesn't happen very often but it does happen. around 5-7 years old. 

Glad to know just to be careful with him till it closes or watch it if it doesn't close. thanks again for the useful info! 

My dobermans best friend is a min pin mix, so I think they will be fine once Axl is feeling better. I was just asking to see if anyone on here had big dogs and chis. 

I am going to post pictures in the picture section. thanks again!


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## Guess (Sep 23, 2009)

I think what you're talking about is Hypothyroidism, which is the only thing I can think of that has been linked to aggression in dogs. It is a thyroid issue, which is located at the base of your throat. But, if you could enlighten me to this disease you're talking about, please do. I have had Dobes my whole life, and this is new to me. :3


Edited in: I think you are talking about cushings disease, which is actually not rare at all in all dog breeds. It's unfortunately all too common.

I was talking about the myth about the brain continuing to grow after the skull stops growing, which is a popular myth in the Doberman breed. Cushings is common in many breeds, who do not share this myth, despite the disease.

All I was trying to point out is that your vet seems very uneducated about the Chihuahua breed, which could very well end up detrimental to your pup down the road.

Anyway, I'll shut up now before I dig myself a deeper hole.


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## cprcheetah (May 4, 2009)

As for big & little dogs, it depends on the dog, my standard poodle Cassie was EXCELLENT with Zoey, always, I think she thought she was one of her puppies, she would play with her gently etc, however, my Golden Retriever is a different story, I have to really watch her with the little dogs, she doesn't know her own size and is very 'pushy' when playing so I take her to doggie daycare to get her 'playtimes' lol. Zoey does play with my cats quite a bit, Mercedes and Mini Dee, she has a blast with them.

I've attached a picture of Zoey & Cassie when Zoey was a puppy.


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## RelicDobes (Sep 23, 2009)

I guess where I heard the glad swelling was from a pit owner that had to put their dog down due to human aggression that had never been seen before. the vet said there was swelling on the brain that caused the issue, and most likely it was due to a glad not working well. When I try to google it it only comes up as the myth and I can't find anything. so maybe the vet was wrong. I don't know. 

I a not saying i believe the head stops growing the brain keeps growing and they go crazy!!! I am not saying that at all!!!! 

just that I have known someone that had a brain related aggression issue. I think it may have been a tumor on the gland that caused pressure and thus the aggression. the vet said it was common in bully breeds, dobes, pits, rotts etc. maybe not. who knows. 

but who cares. I am here to talk about my chi, I am glad you reassured me he is going to be ok as long as I am careful with him. he is feeling much better after his reaction and my dobe and him got to interact a little tonight. Renic (dobe) laid down and I just let Axl (chi) sniff him all over and see that Renic won't hurt him. it went well.


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## svdreamer (Feb 20, 2010)

I have a 55 pound lab/pit mix that plays all the time with my chis. He is very gentle with them. I have never ever even heard a yelp from any of them when he plays with them. That said, you know your dog the best, so supervise their play would be a great idea. I had a few with an open molera, they are all closed now. I never had any problems even with the rough play they get into with each other.


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## 18453 (Feb 6, 2010)

Both mine have them my 9 month old is about 1/2" long and .5cm wide my 14 week old is about the size of a 50p piece!!

I'd change vets


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