# Anyone had a dog shipped to them? help...



## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Some of you know.. some may not.
I am in the process of buying a dog from a breeder in the USA.

She was telling me today his flight here to Toronto is 10 hours from Oregon, she said he has a 2 hour layover in Newark NJ.

This sounds??? too long? the dog is 2 pounds 14 oz so he is not super small but not big either.. but I am very concerned that seems a long time to go with no food water or potty 
I guess there is only one airline flying dogs now? and this is my only option?

I am so confused.. if anyone knows about shipping dogs to Canada quickly and safely please let me know? I don't want to receive a sick or freaked out dog!


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## 18453 (Feb 6, 2010)

Urgh sounds way to long for me and he's a vsmall dog under 3lb is teeny


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

This is what I am thinking Sarah 

I wonder if I can arrange my own shipping or something... ugh!


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

That is a long flight. The dog will probably be stressed when he gets there. I would provide a very quiet place for him when he gets home. I know it's hard not to fuss over them when they just come home, but it will be in his best interest just to rest for about 24 hours in a quiet, calm area. Plenty of food, water, nice bed, no noise, calm petting, etc. They are sometime to stressed to eat and drink in a new environment, so you may have to do some coaxing to get him to eat. From his latest video he looks to be a good enough size that he will probably be okay with a good meal right before leaving his home, and a dose of Nutri-Cal. I would check to make sure that they provide him water while in flight, and lay over. Bring some canned food with you to pick him up. Or better yet get you some Beechnut, Chicken only baby food. They will almost always eat that. Don’t give him much, since it isn’t his normal diet. Have on hand his regular food as well. If he is eating kibble you can use a bit of the baby food to coat his kibble in. I bet you are getting super excited! A dose of Nutri-Cal when you pick him up from the airport might be a good idea too. 

PS~ I don't think the breeder would send him off if she thought he wouldn't be okay.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Another option is for you to buy a round trip flight to pick him up. About the same price, and he can ride in the cabin with you in a carrier, or small crate.


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Well my concern T is that I think 10 hours is a long time.. and I cannot seem to get clear information as to WHY it HAS to be a 10 hour flight? I mean surely there has to be direct flights??

What airline is best for shipping dogs in the US? 
Anyone?


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

I thought of this T, but I don't have a passport yet.. and getting one would delay this.
Never used to need it.. stupid terrorists!


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

I would call or check online all the airlines and their pet shipping policies, and see if you can find a shorter flight. 10 hours is a very long time to be in route.


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Right because I know Toronto to Florida is like what 3.5 hours max?


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

I would def. call and try to make diff. arrangements.


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## Reese and Miley (Jun 24, 2010)

Youre right, this sounds ridiculously long. A puppy should be sent on a DIRECT flight, Im surprised the breeder wouldnt insist on it. Can you get her on the phone to discuss your concerns and offer to find a shorter, direct flight for your pup?


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

It's been a super challenging transaction.
I also just found out there are extra fees involved now as well when I pick him up from the airport.
I think I need to make some phone calls and see if I can sort this out.

What airlines in the US ship dogs? anyone have good experience with anything?
The airline she is telling me she uses is Continental.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Kitty, to be on the safest side, I would get your passport and pick him up so he can ride in cabin if you can't find a shorter flight. He is more than likely going to be super stressed from that long of a flight.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Continental is our "major" airline. Also check Southwest. One other, let me check.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

United, Delta, and American airlines


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

She is telling me Continental is the only airline that will ship international.. 
This is not overseas.. its freaking Canada!!! 
I am sooo confused.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

The best thing to do is call and check for yourself so you feel more at ease. Google those airlines, give em' a call, and they will transfer you to the right dpt.  Let us know.


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

T I am going to send you an email right now! watch out for it.
Tell me what you think.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

K. 

Looks like all our airlines ship pets to Canada, from what I can tell anyway. Not sure on the flight length though.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Did she get the health cert. that he needs for travel?


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

*****************************************************


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

TLI said:


> Did she get the health cert. that he needs for travel?


Yes she is having me pay for that as well as his rabies as well as his crate.
Is this standard?


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## MsGramma (Jul 23, 2010)

I never had a pup shipped but wanted to say good luck and can't wait till that baby is in Your arms


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

No. What they charge for the pup includes the vaccines that have been given. Health cert. and crate is included in shipping price. Unless she quoted you the actual flight cost. The flight is usually around $100, or so. I'd have to double check that, but that's what it was a year back, or so. Most breeders charge about $250 for shipping, some $300 to include all the extras.


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

A "typical" price to ship a puppy is about $300. That should include his travel documents (health check by vet, etc.). She already gave him the rabies??? Hmmmm...... that is not due by the airlines until 4 months at the earliest so I'm wondering why she had that given already.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Oh, and I have no clue what extras are charged, if any for shipping to Canada.


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Ok T I sent you a couple e-mails check them out.
And Ms Gramma thank you! this has been a harrying ordeal.
I wish I could close my eyes blink and have him appear here!


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Brodysmom he is almost 11 mos.


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

TLI said:


> No. What they charge for the pup includes the vaccines that have been given. Health cert. and crate is included in shipping price. Unless she quoted you the actual flight cost. The flight is usually around $100, or so. I'd have to double check that, but that's what it was a year back, or so. Most breeders charge about $250 for shipping, some $300 to include all the extras.


Ok so this is about right, I was quoted 300.00 for shipping.


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

KittyD said:


> Brodysmom he is almost 11 mos.


Oh, I misread that!! 

Well, if you don't feel comfortable with the deal it's not too late to back out. Go to travelocity or cheaptickets.com and put in their departing city and your arrival city and see what flights are available. Surely there would be one shorter than 10 hours?

I have had a dog shipped to me (Molly years ago from NH) and a ferret (from MN) and both were direct flights with no problems at all. 

The cost to the breeder is usually about $100 per leg. So if it's a direct flight, it's right around $100. I understand if they want to charge a little extra for their gas, the crate, etc. But I don't think they should use it as a money making thing.


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## Reese and Miley (Jun 24, 2010)

If I were you I would be having some serious doubts as well I think at this point. Is this the first time she has shipped to Canada? As others stated, most charge a flat rate of $200-300 for shipping which covers their time, the flight, the crate, etc to ship a pup. This all sounds rather backwards. And usually they have one airline they stick with and insist on making the arrangements so they can get the pup the shortest flight possible with a direct route. Most avoid stop overs entirely because that adds the risk that the pup could be put on the wrong flight and sent to the wrong place or forgotten, etc. A stopover makes the flight much riskier for a pup traveling alone. 
TLI mentioned Southwest, they dont fly into Canada but you could do Buffalo and fly out to pick the puppy up. You could also have the breeder check to see if better flights are available going into Buffalo, so it isnt an international flight and you would be the one crossing the border with the pup. I know they do rush passports as well and you can pay a bit extra to get one in a few days. I was able to get mine in TO on Christmas Eve!
If you cant work out a better flight, Id be looking for another pup locally.


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## Reese and Miley (Jun 24, 2010)

And if this pup is already 11 months, shouldnt she have given the rabies about 6 months ago?? Why would she be charging you for that?


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Reese and Miley said:


> And if this pup is already 11 months, shouldnt she have given the rabies about 6 months ago?? Why would she be charging you for that?


Good point!
I don't know if I should cry or scream right now.


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

I wouldn't freak out. Just try and find an alternate flight for her to put him on. She may prefer Continental because they have counter to counter service which is a huge PLUS. I would want him in the pressurized part of the plane, not down where the luggage is. Many airlines still put them underneath. 

Look at Continental's website and see if you can find a more direct flight?


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Kitty, crate weighs 2 lbs. 9 oz. (I don't use a crate, but had this one in the shed. It's dirty, but just wanted you to see.)


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

I know you are stressed.  It will all work out. (((Hugs)))


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## Aquarius (May 8, 2009)

Would it make it any easier, financially, time spent in air etc if you were to drive down to the nearest American airport - Detroit or somesuch?


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## flippedstars (Dec 16, 2009)

Brodysmom said:


> I wouldn't freak out. Just try and find an alternate flight for her to put him on. She may prefer Continental because they have counter to counter service which is a huge PLUS. I would want him in the pressurized part of the plane, not down where the luggage is. Many airlines still put them underneath.
> 
> Look at Continental's website and see if you can find a more direct flight?


The cargo hold, where pets are put, is pressurized. It is "lightly" heated, staying around 65 degrees if its cold (which of course it is once you're up on the air) but if you're on the ground, there is nothing cooling the compartment.

As far as pet shipping goes, Continental is generally accepted as the best, but none are great in my opinion. I think the pup will be fine, but you won't know for sure til he's crawling out of the crate into your arms. If its an exceptionally hot or cold day, the pup shouldn't be shipped.


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## flippedstars (Dec 16, 2009)

They should offer the pup water, too, on the ground, but I just don't know that I would say I trust them to do so. We had to ship Laurel once and it was evident that they had offered her water. The part that worries me is the 2 hour layover...if the pup is kept where they generally are, it will be outside...and extreme weather just doesn't go over well w/ our little guys in big doses.


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Someone on here recently had a dog shipped from Texas to Montreal.. who was that again?
I'd love to know who the carrier was and how the puppy did.


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## LDMomma (Mar 28, 2009)

I've never had a dog shipped but from what I've seen it costs like 250-300. I considered getting Roxy shipped but we ended up driving to get her instead.

Do you have anyone that you could buy a round ticket for that would fly to get him?

Where in FL is he coming from? We have tons of international airports so you can check costs for flights to/from a couple of them depending on where she's located. There's literally 3 international airports within 1.5 hours from my house. We almost always go from Tampa but we could also do St. Pete or Orlando.

ETA: Or maybe you could pay someone to fly and get him. I did that once for my step-mom, I flew with her dog from Tampa to Buffalo. She bought mt ticket and gave me $200 for my time. It would cost you more but I think it's safer.


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## flippedstars (Dec 16, 2009)

Where in FL is the breeder shipping the pup from?


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## LovesMyPups (Apr 18, 2010)

I think Kitty said her new pup is coming from Oregon, not Florida. Maybe I made that up though. lol

In 2005 I had Lo shipped to me on Continental. She was shipped from South Carolina, to Houston, then finally to Portland, Oregon where I was able to pick her up. All together this was around 8hours by herself in the crate. Although I do not know how she was treated before I got there, they roughly handled her crate while I was standing right there and dropped it on the ground instead of handing it to me or gently setting it on the ground softly. I was furious...

She was a baby, about 1.5lbs (I was told 12weeks, however things don't add up and she was actually 9weeks... ya another story) and she was extremely shaken by the experience. She had messed AAAAALLLLLL OVER in the crate, an immediate bath was necessary. She needed nutri-cal as she seemed a little wobbly, and wouldn't eat or drink anything. A good nights sleep changed everything though.

The next day she was totally fine. Eating, drinking, pooing regularly. My happy little girl. Her health check the next day at the vet was A-OK, too. 

In the end, it all turned out "fine" and obviously I'm very happy I got my little girl. However, I wouldn't have another puppy shipped... especially not with a connecting flight!

Where in Oregon is the breeder? I am in Southern Oregon and don't know of many around here. Would love to add another local breeder to my list of potentials! 

I really hope everything goes well and you have time to get it all straightened out. Best of luck!

ETA: I paid an extra $200 for Lo to be shipped. Included flight, health check, crate, food, puppy pads, and nutri-cal. But again, this was all in 2005!


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## LDMomma (Mar 28, 2009)

LovesMyPups said:


> I think Kitty said her new pup is coming from Oregon, not Florida. Maybe I made that up though. lol


Reading comprehension fail on my part.


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## Reese and Miley (Jun 24, 2010)

I hope you can get something worked out! I think your best bet is to see what other, more direct flights open up if you try the closest US airport, Buffalo, Detroit, whatevers nearest to you.
Let us know what happens!


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Yes thanks I am not sure what to do right now, Just trying to process. I need to call some airlines but today is not good timing we are up to our eyeballs in some other stuff.

I don't have a contract with the breeder and I was never told my deposit was non refundable and because I think the issue lies with her arrangements as opposed to anything I have done, I should be able to get it back if I decide it's not the best idea to proceed.

However I have a feeling she won't return my deposit so this may be a situation where I walk and loose money...its been a problematic adventure from the start and I have learned that you should never deal with people unless you can see them face to face.

I really have to think about this, it seems there should be a different flight available.
and even then.. simple things like my questions I ask should not be ignored or cast over by the breeder and I get the feeling she is motivated purely by money at this point and that is nerve wracking for me.


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## MisStingerRN (May 16, 2010)

sorry this has been such a nightmare kitty. You know how I feel..I think the transaction should make you feel good at the end of the day. Instead you are just going through one thing after another with all this. Just listen to you gut...it all smells a bit fishy to me.

(((HUGS))) hon.


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## N*T*M*4U (Nov 10, 2008)

I found this on Continental airline....

Does my pet qualify to be shipped as cargo through PetSafe?
If your pet does not meet the requirements for travel in the cabin or you would like your pet to travel unaccompanied, contact Continental Live Animal Desk at 1-800-575-3335 or 281-553-5052 for more information.

What is the PetSafe?
Dedicated 24-hour Live Animal Desk (1-800-575-3335 or 281-553-5052).
Confirmed booking.
Weather conditions constantly monitored at all points.
Ability to track and trace the animal from its origin to its destination.
Personal handling in climate-controlled vehicles for connections when the animal will be exposed to temperatures above 85 degrees (F) for more than 45 minutes.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

**********






***********-----**********------*********


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

yes round trip would be ok also but kitty would still need to go through custom in canada...


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

yes i live in oregon. i just dont understand why its any business of people to know where I live. I have shipped 5 other times with in the US never international. I only ship with continental because in cargo the temp is the same as cabin. if to hot out side the a/c gets turned on if to cold the heat gets turned on. the rabies had to be done 30days before shipping Dusti to canada. I call and found it out and told kitty and we set appointment up and did it on aug 10th. I normally don't do rabie for my small chihuahua until a year old. Dusti is 2lb 15oz and to me its small to have rabie but he need it to be able to leave to his new homes. I know some do rabie at 6 months or even 16 weeks but each person is different. I have a friend who is a breed that live in Canada and she also said their is no way around Custom if you fight it you will lose the dog or animal you have. some air line have a in cabin fee to carry the animal with you...i saw one that is 100 international...i charge a flat rate of 300...i wont get the rest of the payment or shipping cost until the 18th and i am planing on shipping or meeting kitty at the air port. i normally dont do same day unles its locally. i knwo each person does it different. i have always done it this way.....if shipping needed to be 1 to 3 weeks paid in full. I am not asking this of Kitty. if any one else has question please contact me and i will be happy to answer...


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

TLI said:


> I would call or check online all the airlines and their pet shipping policies, and see if you can find a shorter flight. 10 hours is a very long time to be in route.


the canada has their own policies...i gave the number if she has any questions to call them. i have called around to a few different air lines and those have lay overs some will be longer lay overs and longer


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

TLI said:


> Did she get the health cert. that he needs for travel?


you can not get the health cert this early it has to be with in 10 day of shipping. but i like to do it the day before...


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> Yes she is having me pay for that as well as his rabies as well as his crate.
> Is this standard?


health cert is standard to be paid by the buyer....


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> Brodysmom he is almost 11 mos.


he is 10 months born nov 4th 2009....


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

Personally, I think you should be talking to Kitty in private about this and not discussing it on a public forum with flight schedules and numbers and such. But that is just me.

I understand that you would want to defend yourself. I think that most people were just concerned that the dog would be in flight for 10 hours. That's a long time to be shut in a crate in an airport/airplane. 

I do think that Continental is one of the most reputable carriers for shipping dogs and has a good track record.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

jessicao32 said:


> you can not get the health cert this early it has to be with in 10 day of shipping. but i like to do it the day before...


Yes, I know. I thought he was leaving within the next few days.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Can you snap a few pics of the cute lil guy real quick so we can see his sweet face?


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

Reese and Miley said:


> And if this pup is already 11 months, shouldnt she have given the rabies about 6 months ago?? Why would she be charging you for that?


i am not charging for the rabies....and dusti being small 2lb 15oz i normally dont do them until 12 months... each person does them different


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

TLI said:


> Can you snap a few pics of the cute lil guy real quick so we can see his sweet face?


Kitty has the most current picture of Dusti...i also sent her a video of him also....


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

I just did a quick search on the internet and there ARE shorter flights available. These are both non stop flights and they are a total flight time of just over 4 hours. 

Example ....

United, flight 8604
Sat, Sep 18 Portland, OR (PDX) to
Toronto, ON Canada (YYZ)
Flight Time: 4hrs 16min 8:00am to
3:16pm United
Flight 8604
operated by Air Canada
Embraer EMB E90 Jet

Or ...

Air Canada, flight 532
Sat, Sep 18 Portland, OR (PDX) to
Toronto, ON Canada (YYZ)
Flight Time: 4hrs 16min 8:00am to
3:16pm Air Canada
Flight 532
Embraer EMB E90 J


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Kitty, can you post the video here? The most recent one.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

Brodysmom said:


> I just did a quick search on the internet and there ARE shorter flights available. These are both non stop flights and they are a total flight time of just over 4 hours.
> 
> Example ....
> 
> ...


i called air canada and their is a lay over in van for 3 hours and than another 5 or so hours to Toronto....


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

TLI said:


> Kitty, can you post the video here? The most recent one.


i dont know how to repost it....or i would...she told me before she didnt want her business out so i am leaving it up to her to post pictures and videos of Dusti. i am not saying this to be mean or rude...just I am leaving it for her to show you...or i would


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

jessicao32 said:


> i dont know how to repost it....or i would...she told me before she didnt want her business out so i am leaving it up to her to post pictures and videos of Dusti. i am not saying this to be mean or rude...just I am leaving it for her to show you...or i would


That's okay.


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

jessicao32 said:


> i dont know how to repost it....or i would...she told me before she didnt want her business out so i am leaving it up to her to post pictures and videos of Dusti. i am not saying this to be mean or rude...just I am leaving it for her to show you...or i would


Hey there.

Actually I have over 1000 posts here and I LOVE this community 
I trust the ladies here completely. You can search all my posts, I have nothing to hide  I never said I "don't like my info out there"

I have asked you questions many times about things and I tend to get blown off by you and I am not sure why you want me to research flights when as a breeder I thought that would be your job? I have no idea, I have never shipped a dog.. and I am very concerned about a 10 hour flight as you said he would not get any food 4 hours before the fight.

I think the safely of this little dog is paramount and I am not interested in placing him in a risky situation at the cost of saving a few dollars, and I honestly cannot understand why you would have such a problem with this.

For the record I never mentioned your name in this thread.. you came here and outed yourself, so be it! This forum is where I get accurate info I can trust from other Chi moms. 

In fact I tried to tag a few friends here in a pic of Dusti off of your facebook and I received a chastising Facebook message from you the next day telling me not to show people your pictures.

Unfortunately T, I am unable to post the video here because due to Jessica's privacy settings it's not allowed. She emailed me a partial clip of the video but it's not the same.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

As I said to you on Skype Kitty I hide food int he shedded paper in the crate. i also give nutra-cal the whole day of shipping. I am also going to mix nutra-cal and water together and put it in his water dish and make it icee so as it melts he can lick it and get his water that way...air lines dont take the animal out to potty or feed them. you can hire a person to do that and care for you animal but it will cost more. I have no clue why the air line will take 10 hours. at the 2 hour lay over he will get water from the air line. i have given you pictures and video of dusti. i am not blowing any thing off i am being blunt about Dusti to you. I am not here going to rip you off or send you a sick dogs. I know you are freak the heck out that I may do this but I have told you over and over again i am not giving you some BS or going to send you a sick dog. Yes i am a breeder and I do my part. shippign internationally is so out of my ball games. I jsut found out everything that i send you early today. than things got out of controll. people make mistake and type in the wrong things everything can be fixed by calling. yes it say 8 lbs that is crate and dusti together..its say 10weeks when is shoudl say 10 months...i have been honest with you on everything and blunt yes i may come off B**** but i am sorry you take it that way...I am only telling you want i know and found out. i am not miss know it all for shipping...i like the air line i am shipping with...if you want to find a different one that is cool with me you just got to let me know asap so i can make the right call. also keep in mine different airlines will cost more...i knwo air canada told me 200 to 250 that is just air far not the health cert or crate..i truly hope these people can easy your mind i even gave you the number to call if you have question that was given to me...so i hope they can help..


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

TLI said:


> That's okay.


I found a way to post it here...i hope this works...enjoy 




YouTube - Dusti


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## flippedstars (Dec 16, 2009)

jessicao32 said:


> I found a way to post it here...i hope this works...enjoy
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What a cute lil munchkin he is!


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

thank you...he such a sweet little guy...


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## cherper (May 8, 2009)

aww he's so cute. Leila does that silly stuff too. lol


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## LDMomma (Mar 28, 2009)

He's so tiny!


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

yes he is cute and very playful...he goes under my couch when he plays...

LD Momma yes he is tiny. i have his half brother who is 7 months and 2lb 8oz


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## LovesMyPups (Apr 18, 2010)

jessicao32 said:


> yes i live in oregon. i just dont understand why its any business of people to know where I live.


Hello, I did ask where you lived, but purely because I have not completed my pack (i would love to have one more) and I really don't know very many breeders close to me (I'm in Oregon, too!) and I like to be able to visit. 
I apologize if you felt I was being snoopy, that was not my intention at all! 

Also, Dusti is about the cutest thing I've ever seen! Soooooo precious! Congrats to Kitty!


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

If you would have contacted me last saturday i could help you but i dont have anymore...i am keeping the last four...would you like me to help please sent me a pm and i will be great ful


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## PerisMomma (Aug 2, 2010)

I think when we shipped our two dogs in 2005 it was a 8ish hr trip(NC to OR)


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

Brodysmom said:


> I just did a quick search on the internet and there ARE shorter flights available. These are both non stop flights and they are a total flight time of just over 4 hours.
> 
> Example ....
> 
> ...


Thank you Tracey! 

Jessica what about these? times seem much better.
And earlier today in our chat you had not mentioned you were sending him with Nutrical. I had only read you were sending him with Cheerios and with his small size I was concerned about him not eating 4 hours before his flight and then having nothing for 10 hours.


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

Dusti is a very handsome little guy! So cute how he wiggles all around. :lol: Thank you for posting the video.


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## TripleAChihuahuas (Apr 8, 2010)

KittyD said:


> Thank you Tracey!
> 
> Jessica what about these? times seem much better.
> And earlier today in our chat you had not mentioned you were sending him with Nutrical. I had only read you were sending him with Cheerios and with his small size I was concerned about him not eating 4 hours before his flight and then having nothing for 10 hours.


I think she said these were longer lay overs and more expensive. 
I know there is a lot of miscommunication between the two very busy women.
there has been plenty of small dogs shipped and I think she knows what to do in this case, she loves him and wouldn't put him in any danger or harms way. you need to write out all your questions and then Jessica you need to respond to each one. I think the problem was Jessica just found out about the customs since she never shipped out of the USA and she sent this and told you so you can know a head of time. I am trying my hardest to stay out of it.. I have known Jessica for a couple of years and became friends for the past year she is honest and blunt some people don't know how to deal with it. Stop making things harder and take each step forward not backward. You have had doubts since early on but made your mind up to go through it and was reassured about Dusti is what she said he was and what you said you were looking for from the begaining. somethings aren't easy but they don't have to be this hard either. 
I hope you both can work this out.


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## TripleAChihuahuas (Apr 8, 2010)

TLI said:


> Dusti is a very handsome little guy! So cute how he wiggles all around. :lol: Thank you for posting the video.


T I wanted to personaly thank you for your help in this matter, you gave great advice and even weighed the crate!


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

Cynthia well said and thank you.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> Thank you Tracey!
> 
> Jessica what about these? times seem much better.
> And earlier today in our chat you had not mentioned you were sending him with Nutrical. I had only read you were sending him with Cheerios and with his small size I was concerned about him not eating 4 hours before his flight and then having nothing for 10 hours.


It will most likely cost you more than 300 as I told you. Are you willing to pay the extra also we have to look at cargo live animal. These seem to have lay overs some where because 8am to 3pm is not 4 hours but I will see in the morning.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> Thank you Tracey!
> 
> Jessica what about these? times seem much better.
> And earlier today in our chat you had not mentioned you were sending him with Nutrical. I had only read you were sending him with Cheerios and with his small size I was concerned about him not eating 4 hours before his flight and then having nothing for 10 hours.


Kitty u will still have to pay custom. Thought I would add that before I for get. If u don't do custom u can lose ur animal. Either in cabin or cargo both will have to be done with custom once in Canada at ur airport


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

Kitty
I wanted to let you know I have spoke with air Canada early today and their fly will be longer than 8 or 10 hours and their lay over is 3 hours and than in the air for another 5 hours before getting to Toronto. I will call again in the morning but I wanted to put this up before I forget. I know I posted it already if u look back in a few post. I was also told the air fair would be 200-250. This not adding crate and health cert. Also not adding customs. This little chihuahuas are good. They don't eat from 6pm until noting about 7am so shipping won't be a big thing. I will have food tape to the out side of crate to feed him once lands. He will have nutra cal mixed in iced for him to lick. Some dogs going over seas sond get feed unless the layover is longer. We I will look into these and post what I find.


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

TripleAChihuahuas said:


> I think she said these were longer lay overs and more expensive.
> I know there is a lot of miscommunication between the two very busy women.
> there has been plenty of small dogs shipped and I think she knows what to do in this case, she loves him and wouldn't put him in any danger or harms way. you need to write out all your questions and then Jessica you need to respond to each one. I think the problem was Jessica just found out about the customs since she never shipped out of the USA and she sent this and told you so you can know a head of time. I am trying my hardest to stay out of it.. I have known Jessica for a couple of years and became friends for the past year she is honest and blunt some people don't know how to deal with it. Stop making things harder and take each step forward not backward. You have had doubts since early on but made your mind up to go through it and was reassured about Dusti is what she said he was and what you said you were looking for from the begaining. somethings aren't easy but they don't have to be this hard either.
> I hope you both can work this out.


This problem has had nothing to do with customs, I have already spoken to my airport and they do not charge duties or customs on live animals being shipped to their home.
I am aware you are friends with Jessica.. you were the person who told me about her dog and you vouched for her and I decided to go with her dog on your recommendation, however you and I both know there have been issues and unlike you I am not going to air them here just to score some "brownie points" In fact I never even mentioned Jessica's name today! you two came here and did a fine job with that, so much for not getting involved.

I agree things do not need to be hard, but when a person is asking questions about an animal they plan to own the next 15, 16 years or however long he may live I think I am well within my entitlement, and I think it's concerning when someone brushes off questions and says "dude don't worry about it" yes that in fact bothers me.

Several of the ladies on this board know me pretty well and I can assure you I am doing my absolute best to be both an educated buyer concerned about the welfare of a dog and a responsible animal owner. I am sorry if this concerns either of you, but there has been a few things along the way that has raised red flags for me.

Since we are putting this all out here now :coolwink:

I also want to touch on one more thing Cynthia, being honest and blunt are fine qualities, however it's all about how you convey the message. Jessica has been hot headed, flippant and downright rude to me on a few occasions you have also mentioned this to me and said you are "used to it" perfect for you then, however I have a business background and have come to expect a certain level of decorum, especially when I am paying someone 800.00 USD for a dog. 

I can tell you if you choose a job that aligns you with the public and entails dealing with people to facilitate transactions such as this, you need to know how to have some people skills.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

Kitty
U asked question that were not a big deal 8 LbS and 10 weeks I said no big deal and not to worry cause I have don't this before so I knew what they ment. 8 Lbs is crate and dog weigh together. 10 weeks can be fix. U and I know the weigh of dusti and his age. Yes ppl can know u here but do they know u in real life anyone can act like anyone. I am not a fake person I tell how it is. Yes I am being blunt. Sorry u feel I have been rude to you. I have friend who has shipped from FL to Canada and she has to pay custom. She is the one who told me on top of the air lines. That number I gave you is who u need to call. I am only telling u what I am told. If you had question should have called that number. U still can. People on this can't always answer question they can only give what they think and help point in the right way. Their are web site and number that can help with international shipping and customs I can get those inthe morning and link them here. We also got to make sure we are asking live animal in cargo and not cabin unles u are picking up. Well hope something can work out


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## pigeonsheep (Nov 8, 2008)

lol...wow...all this drama for a chi. i would just get one nearby instead of all this hoopla...imo. esp with the cheerios remark  sorry kitty ur goin thru so much


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

pigeonsheep said:


> lol...wow...all this drama for a chi. i would just get one nearby instead of all this hoopla...imo. esp with the cheerios remark  sorry kitty ur goin thru so much


AJ Says Woof Dex! luv ya Pidge! 


Jessica I found the following.
http://www.aircanada.com/cargo/en/services/document/pet_pricing_us_ca2.pdf

As I mentioned earlier today Canada is not considered an "international destination" its considered a "North American" destination.
I suspect part of the issue at hand is that you admittedly have not shipped out of the USA before.


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## MisStingerRN (May 16, 2010)

Really sorry this has been such a trial kitty...hugs to ya babe xxx


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## Adrienne (Apr 3, 2009)

Wow Kitty this is insane! it just seems like so much ... I hope you can work things out.... 
xo


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

MisStingerRN said:


> Really sorry this has been such a trial kitty...hugs to ya babe xxx


Thanks hun!



Adrienne said:


> Wow Kitty this is insane! it just seems like so much ... I hope you can work things out....
> xo


It's definitely been a bit more than I bargained for.


Anyhow ladies, thanks.. Stacia as you know so well it was never my intent to create a complicated thread, I just needed advice on animal shipping because it's not something I do, I am not a breeder.

I know there are so many knowledgeble people here including other breeders who are always happy to help  I mean where else would I ask?

Unfortunately the thread turned into a defensive situation.


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## rocky scotland (Jun 15, 2008)

Wow so much drama! Checked out his vid and he looks so work it, what a cute wee guy he is, can't wait to see more pics.

Hope it all works out for you Kitty xx


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## foggy (Oct 12, 2009)

I'm so sorry it's become so complicated for you, Kitty.  I just watched the video and he is sooo precious. I can totally see why he's touched your heart. I really hope it works out for you, hon. xx


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## Terri (Aug 21, 2009)

Kitty after reading this am afraid if it was me i would walk away, no matter how cute the puppy is.
I wouldnt take rudeness well either, a breeder is supposed to be helpful and put a person's mind at ease.
Oh and answer all questions too!

It's not like you are getting the pup for free so they are doing you a favour is it? lol
It's up to you hon, but am sure you could get another closer to home.
If somethng is this difficult and you have had many red flags is it really worth it?
That is just my opinion.

Whatever happens i wish you luck anyway. xx


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> AJ Says Woof Dex! luv ya Pidge!
> 
> 
> Jessica I found the following.
> ...


like i have told you and on here so others can see is that I told you what I was told. and if you had any questions is to call that number i gave you...


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

*************************


****

}


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> Thanks hun!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



YOU dont have to be a BREEDER to ship....i am NO longer a breeder


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

**********


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## 18453 (Feb 6, 2010)

Wow........ I've gotta headache


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

*********


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

I almost forgot to add this link...Canadian Food Inspection Agency - Importing Domestic Dogs hope this can help...

I wanted to share that this subject is closed and if i have anything thing else to say in this matter I will be emailing Kitty off this fourm. this subject is closed I will no longer post to it but I will keep a close eye on it....thank you and have a wonderful day


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## *Chloe* (Feb 6, 2006)

please can you keep the private details of this and the flights and such to private correspondance .. the OP was asking for experiences/advice of shipping a chi and this has gone way off track


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## TripleAChihuahuas (Apr 8, 2010)

Yes I agree it got out of hand when Kitty didn't put all information so this can be answered plus others went off topic before Jessica or I came on here. And I never said a name and didn't come on here till the 9th page so I don't know what you(Kitty) are talking about me saying names.

I only wanted to clear something on my part- I didn't give Kitty Jessica's info until after she saw a picture of Dusti from another breeder in Canada on her website and Kitty said he is perfect and I said I know her from online and will give you her website and you can email her if that is the route you want to go.
Sorry if things got out of hand but I have no control over your personal messages to eachother and you both called me in the middle and I tried to help but all it got me was in this mess. 
I told you before if you(Kitty) don't or didn't feel confortable with this all then just tell her(jessica).


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

Cynthia- I wanted to say thank you for the listening. I am sorry you got in the middle of things. 

I personality think if any person has a problem with another person they should take a few deep breath and relax than email or call and talk to the person. I would not be posting or forwarding emails to other people. I have took all the info of the air lines off at Chloe said that is to be taken off. I also feel i am being very honest and blunt about info that is given to me and passing it along. I also wanted to state I am not going to send a sick dog. I am not here to give some BS or rip someone off. 

I believe this subject has been taken way out their and the iusse or problems and question should between the two people and not alot of people. In order to get the right info. I believe contacting the International Shipping would be a great starts. I would also look into Canada Customs and see what they have to say about Import of animal. I believe that is where the real good info will come from. 

I know all of us are giving it a shot and trying to help.I have only shipped in the US and never International. So I am learning as well and passing along the info that is given to me.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

CFIA Website--- Canadian Food Inspection Agency - Importing Domestic Dogs

Tax Here under Ontario... non-commercial imports: A & A Contract Customs Brokers - Online tax tables, Canadian PST, GST, HST tax tables online

I hope this helps....


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

rocky scotland said:


> Wow so much drama! Checked out his vid and he looks so work it, what a cute wee guy he is, can't wait to see more pics.
> 
> Hope it all works out for you Kitty xx


I agree on the drama this has about done my head in.



foggy said:


> I'm so sorry it's become so complicated for you, Kitty.  I just watched the video and he is sooo precious. I can totally see why he's touched your heart. I really hope it works out for you, hon. xx


Thanks 



Terri said:


> Kitty after reading this am afraid if it was me i would walk away, no matter how cute the puppy is.
> I wouldnt take rudeness well either, a breeder is supposed to be helpful and put a person's mind at ease.
> Oh and answer all questions too!
> 
> ...


Terry thank you for putting that out there, my husband is of the same thought process as you and is speechless about this current situation.
I can assure you I am spending the rest of this weekend thinking long and hard about this because it is clear to me we still have issues that I am sure cannot be mitigated due to communication and knowledge base.



jessicao32 said:


> like i have told you and on here so others can see is that I told you what I was told. and if you had any questions is to call that number i gave you...


Jessica you gave me a number for an airport help desk for claiming dogs.
That does not assist me in finding direct flights for the dog, wading through the customs and importations fee's you now say I must face and a whole myriad of other things.



Daisydoo said:


> Wow........ I've gotta headache


Yes.. Advil please? lol



jessicao32 said:


> I almost forgot to add this link...Canadian Food Inspection Agency - Importing Domestic Dogs hope this can help...
> 
> I wanted to share that this subject is closed and if i have anything thing else to say in this matter I will be emailing Kitty off this fourm. this subject is closed I will no longer post to it but I will keep a close eye on it....thank you and have a wonderful day


I scanned that quickly and I am not sure why you have posted it here? It's just general guidelines.. dogs come into Canada from the USA all the time, in fact my parents bought one on holidays once and brought him home, yes he needed his health certificate.. but there was NO additional taxes, duties paid nothing! it's just a pet dog. This is my thread and I will continue to post here as I like, the subject is not closed! lol 




*Chloe* said:


> please can you keep the private details of this and the flights and such to private correspondance .. the OP was asking for experiences/advice of shipping a chi and this has gone way off track


Thanks Chloe, did someone post private correspondence here? I didn't notice that, don't agree with it either. I'd like my thread to get back on track!



TripleAChihuahuas said:


> Yes I agree it got out of hand when Kitty didn't put all information so this can be answered plus others went off topic before Jessica or I came on here. And I never said a name and didn't come on here till the 9th page so I don't know what you(Kitty) are talking about me saying names.
> 
> I only wanted to clear something on my part- I didn't give Kitty Jessica's info until after she saw a picture of Dusti from another breeder in Canada on her website and Kitty said he is perfect and I said I know her from online and will give you her website and you can email her if that is the route you want to go.
> Sorry if things got out of hand but I have no control over your personal messages to eachother and you both called me in the middle and I tried to help but all it got me was in this mess.
> I told you before if you(Kitty) don't or didn't feel confortable with this all then just tell her(jessica).



I have no idea what you are talking about Cynthia, I put all the information in my original post that pertained to this situation. I was not my intent to disclose personal details about whom I was dealing with, however you and Jessica did that perfectly  

Cynthia I am going to publicly correct you, you send me a direct link to Jessica's website. And you told me about him via PM, of which I both still have if needed for verification at that time you told me about a Canadian breeder who did not currently have any dogs. 

Cynthia as I have mentioned to you via phone call once and in a few PM's I have told Jessica in several instances I was not happy with the way things are proceeding, the main issue is she pushes and pushes ahead anyhow.
I've felt quite railroaded! I really dislike it when people skew facts.




jessicao32 said:


> I also wanted to state I am not going to send a sick dog. I am not here to give some BS or rip someone off.
> 
> I believe this subject has been taken way out their and the iusse or problems and question should between the two people and not alot of people. In order to get the right info. I believe contacting the International Shipping would be a great starts. I would also look into Canada Customs and see what they have to say about Import of animal. I believe that is where the real good info will come from.
> 
> I know all of us are giving it a shot and trying to help.I have only shipped in the US and never International. So I am learning as well and passing along the info that is given to me.



Again, Canada from USA is not deemed international shipping  it's classed as within North America. This was my thread about shipping live animals, it was not a thread about politics but the two of you came in here and made it so.




jessicao32 said:


> CFIA Website--- Canadian Food Inspection Agency - Importing Domestic Dogs
> 
> Tax Here under Ontario... non-commercial imports: A & A Contract Customs Brokers - Online tax tables, Canadian PST, GST, HST tax tables online
> 
> I hope this helps....


I have NO idea what this means? I highly doubt there is provincial sales tax on an animal from another country and I highly doubt there is Goods and services tax on a pet dog. Besides that is out of date we have the HST now.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

Well if you think you know about customs than so be it. You asked me and I booked and found out info and gave u what I was told. I am being told by other breeders who live in Canada that what I am learning is to be true. So please ask custom and this is international shipping. Driving down here picking up and driving back would be different.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

I also was talking about sending(forwarding) the email i send you about the info of shipping. YOU have sent that to some of the ppl on here. That has my info and i wish you didnt.if you took my info or such a name and email that i am ok with it.

i would also like the contact number you call that say this is not a international but that is North American as you say


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

jessicao32 said:


> I also was talking about sending(forwarding) the email i send you about the info of shipping. YOU have sent that to some of the ppl on here. That has my info and i wish you didnt.if you took my info or such a name and email that i am ok with it.
> 
> i would also like the contact number you call that say this is not a international but that is North American as you say


Oh and do you have proof of this?


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> Oh and do you have proof of this?


well to be honest with you this is not high school and i dont have to show you anything. but if you must know go back in your thread you can clearly see that you forward the email. what was in it was my email and name if you clearly took it out thank you....


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

****Update***


Hey mods, or whoever the powers that be are 
Can you guys kindly close this thread for me?

I've had some recent developments happen and as a result my husband and I have decided not to pursue Dusti.

As I expected the breeder has changed our verbal agreement again, and is requesting I take him sooner than our arranged plans of the 18th of September, she is demanding final payment a week before we arranged and has stated if I do not buy Dusti as a result my 100.00 deposit is non refundable. Quite honestly? this kind of pressure is not my thing, when I had originally started a thread saying I was looking for a puppy, it was planned for fall, our family has much going on with school, dance classes and settling into our new home and I didn't want to rush a new dog here until the kids had been back at school at least a few weeks (my youngest son will be his first year)

Honestly? 100.00 is not that much to me, and perhaps she needs it more than we do, because I would never act the way she has. She refused paypal so I have no recourse as I stupidly sent her a wire transfer in an act of trust.

I REALLY want everyone here to know when you are dealing with someone.. EVEN someone who is recommended by somebody you know or know via forum get EVERYTHING IN WRITING!!

I unfortunately did not, I am green with this experience and have never ever dealt with a breeder from a different locale. 
I trusted and I got burned. In closing I think it's worth saying that those who know me know I am sweet as Georgia pie! but I will NEVER be backed into a corner.


Thanks for the support... AJ & I woof you!


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

jessicao32 said:


> well to be honest with you this is not high school and i dont have to show you anything. but if you must know go back in your thread you can clearly see that you forward the email. what was in it was my email and name if you clearly took it out thank you....


Jessica get over it, I e-mailed T something entirely different.
Sheesh.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> ****Update***
> 
> 
> Hey mods, or whoever the powers that be are
> ...



as in my email i sent i said the 18th can work still should i post that here??? i know you and i made agreement but its seem that you cant even talk to me you have to go here so i am following it so i can talk to you...if you dont want dusti that is fine. i have worked with you from day one in aug. i even said the money can come on the 18th no big deal all i asked was for you to talk with me


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

KittyD said:


> Jessica get over it, I e-mailed T something entirely different.
> Sheesh.


ok my miss take...ALL I WANT YOU TO IS TALK TO ME SKYPE I ALWAYS SAID I WORK WITH YOU... I DONT GIVE A CRAP ABOUT THE MONEY TO BE HONEST I ALWAYS SAID YOU AND YOUR FAMILY WOULD BA PERFECT HOME FOR DUSTI...I FOUDN OUT ABOUT CUSTOMS AND TOLD YOU I TRIED TO TALK WITH YOU BUT CLEARLY IS NOT WORKING...


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## KittyD (Apr 2, 2010)

jessicao32 said:


> as in my email i sent i said the 18th can work still should i post that here??? i know you and i made agreement but its seem that you cant even talk to me you have to go here so i am following it so i can talk to you...if you dont want dusti that is fine. i have worked with you from day one in aug. i even said the money can come on the 18th no big deal all i asked was for you to talk with me



Jessica I am tired of the games, I don't wish to the post the Facebook message you sent me here as all that is doing is perpetuating drama.
I want this over.. I want the crazy train to stop.
Dusti is a lovely dog but I cannot deal with you or your erratic behavior.. you change things around from one day to the next.
I am posting here because you & Cynthia made it public knowledge here and heck I have nothing to hide and at best this may be educational for a future Chi parent.

So to clarify I am NOT sending you money a week earlier than agreed and I am NOT taking possession of Dusti a week earlier than agreed.
You are far to fixated on the financial aspect of this transaction, have been since day one and while I wish you well in the future I no longer want to be involved.

Technically since you are the person who violated a verbal agreement I suspect my deposit should be returned but as I said keep it.

Enjoy.


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## jessicao32 (Jul 21, 2010)

i never said i was not selling you dusti...i said i dont know what you want to do and i woudl like to know this week and the money but i did state that the 18th woudl still be find. i have tryied to speak with you on skype and emails and you wont even talk to me. i have NOT once say dusti is not coming to you and I have not once stated that I have to have the money this week i stated that i need to know by this week and the money and in the same email i stated the 18th is as plan and will be fine....

WILL YOU PLEASE TALK TO ME ON SKYPE>>>>>


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## *Chloe* (Feb 6, 2006)

i think if ur going to continue this, u both do privately


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