# To breed.... or not to breed.... that is my question!



## * Bailey & Kahlua's Mom * (Nov 10, 2008)

I have been against breeding Bailey, not only because of the over-population of animals out there, or the fact he doesn't have papers etc... but I have received an overwhelming amount of people asking/begging me to breed him. They are all obsessed about the color of his nose, his ears, his eyes, his whole body and attitude etc. I tell them he has no papers and they don't seem to care. They say he is "good tempered", "good quality" etc.

So many actual breeders, not back-yard breeders but people that have been showing Chi's for years have carried on about Bailey's look and attitude. Also that the color of his nose is so rare, that it would be a total shame and tragedy if I got him neutered and didn't stud him out. 

So, I am confused... he is scheduled to be neutered this Friday, so I need to figure this out now. Do I breed him or not? If his nose, body and temperament is so rare... then should I end his line? 

I am looking for thoughts and opinions please. Remember, I have NOT decided I am going to breed him or not at this point, I am only wanting thoughts & opinions. I know how this subject is touchy with many people, so I am wary to bring it up, but I am confused. 

Also, is there a way to get him papered? Like, is there a blood test or something to check his "quality" and if its good, can he then be papered? 

Thanks!


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## jeanie brown (Jan 5, 2009)

i think you are just chickining out oif that operation lol


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## ~*Jessie*~ (Aug 8, 2007)

I know exactly how you mean with how tempting it is. I'm debating whether or not I want to show Tucker, which is a big decision for me because I was planning on definitely neutering him by 6 months of age.

I personally would have Bailey neutered. Then again, I only believe in breeding dogs that are AKC registered. Any good breeder (again, in my opinion) in the USA wouldn't breed a dog without papers. 

There are so many dogs out there with good temperaments/"rare" colors/etc and I personally believe it takes more than that to make a dog breed worthy.

Just my two cents. I hope it wasn't offensive. Bailey is a cutie.


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## freedomchis (Jul 28, 2007)

I wouldn't breed unless he had kc papers because you cant continue a line if he isn't registered but this is only my opinion and i don't like to comment on breeding being new to the breeding side
Bailey is gorgeous btw


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

I wouldn't breed Bailey. Do you know how stud dogs act? Ugh... if you are sick of marking behavior and weenie obsession - just wait until he learns how to use what he has! He will be a mating machine.  And that's not very nice to live with.

I think there are VERY few people who are qualified and should be breeding. It is more than just having a cute dog. The shelters are full of cute dogs. But for me, it's not so much the overpopulation, it's the change in personality that I wouldn't want to live with. I know you think of little Bailey as your baby, but believe me... once he is mated, he won't be the same little Bailey.

Since I have been in the dog show world, I'm a firm believer in showing dogs to their championship before breeding. I know, that's a minority. But I believe the only people who should really be breeding are those who are in it to BETTER and improve the breed. 

We all LOVE Bailey! And he is a cutie. But without papers and without having him actually evaluated against the Chi standard, I'd pass on the breeding.

And no... there's no way to get papers if he doesn't have them. You can do a DNA test that will pinpoint his breed, but that's it. And we all know there are a million different qualities of Chihuahua's, so just saying he is one doesn't prove anything about quality and lineage.

Brodysmom


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## CM Katie (Sep 28, 2005)

Also think about the fact that if you breed him, the puppies might not even look like him at all, they might look like mom (or ancestors). 
I know how it's a little sad once you get them fixed and you know they will never have puppies some day. But it's the best decision not only for Bailey but also because there is serious overpopulation, as you mentioned.
Think of the pros and cons. The only pro you mentioned is that people want puppies that look like him. I think the cons really outweigh the pros.
He is so adorable though, if only we could clone him  I want a Bailey


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## jesshan (Sep 15, 2005)

I understand that you are only testing the water and I don't mean this in a bad way BUT...I personally would say no, not for any other reason than although your young man may be healthy and "good tempered", "good quality" etc. a dog without papers is an unknown quantity. A lot of breeders who know their pedigree knows what faults are in the lines and perhaps wouldn't breed from one dog knowing there was a fault in the lines behind him. It is possible that his father or grandfather had PL, now it may not show up in him however the genetic problem is still there and could come out on the litter he sires.

This is my main annoyance with the people who either cross breed or breed without papers, although their dogs may be sound and healthy they do not know what problems have occurred in their ancestors.

And remember don't be pressed into any descisions - Breeding for a colour is not good.

Happy thinking.....


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## rcj1095 (Mar 4, 2009)

Kim,

He is so unique looking. I don't blame you a bit for considering it. That being said, Brodysmom (once again) is correct.  I seriously considered breeding my former doxie Romeo. He had champion bloodlines (some ridiculous amount of generations) on both sides.

He was sweet, loving, perfectly-tempered, well I could go on and on. I had family and friends beg me to stud him out. Beg me. His breeder even offered to show him and get his 5 majors or whatever you need to finish. 

So we would have had a registered dog, all his titles and all that and a gorgeous, sweet dog. The point I'm trying to get to is how many people talked me out of it. 

Once a boy starts mating, I guess it can be really downhill. They can mark, get obnoxious, change personalities, basically become a different dog.

I wasn't willing to lose my "perfect pet". I wasn't willing to let him mate with other dogs and worry the whole time if something would happen, etc. I just decided (and it's a personal choice) that it wasn't right for me. You would be sick if his perfect little temperament changed, ya know? You'd be mad at yourself.

Now, I will personally support you with whatever decision you make, but think long and hard about this one. We love them all so much we just want to duplicate them. I felt the same way.

Good luck hon with your decision and kiss Bailey.


Robin


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## SillySally (Jan 2, 2009)

You would have to know both parents registration numbers and then you could get him registered. Why is the reason you got him with no papers? Sorry if you mentioned this before and I didn't see the reason. I would also like to know why his nose colored is concidered rare? It is liver colored and that is not rare.

I agree 100% with what Jess said, hes a handsome boy regardless if hes papered or not.

Emma has 67 champions in her pedigree but that does not mean I want to breed her. I bought her strickly for a pet and she will be spayed when she turns 6mos old.


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## Bethany (Mar 16, 2009)

I dont have a suggestion as to whether you should breed him or not- thats up to you. But if he's purebred you could register him through the CKC. Then usually once you get a dog registered through one place its fairly easy to register them through like the APRI for example. I hope that helped. Oh and I guess I dont know if you live in the US or somewhere else but the CKC is in the U.S.
http://www.continentalkennelclub.com/


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## * Bailey & Kahlua's Mom * (Nov 10, 2008)

Thank you everyone, you have helped make up our minds. He will NOT become a stud. I do not want his attitude or temperament to change, I want him to become a little less hyper (if possible) and don't want the marking to ever start. So, that sealed the deal, the boy will remain a virgin! Thank you! 

I just didn't know what to think or do, I mean all these people keep saying they want to breed with him etc and I got to thinking that maybe he should. But, we got him to be a joyful companion in our family, and I don't want him to become a sex crazed monster. 

He doesn't have papers because he was bought from a "back-yard breeder". I guess I don't understand the whole "champion blood line" thing... I always thought a chi was a chi was a chi etc ... I guess I still have lots to learn about the whole AKC CKC thing, I have no idea anything about them. Maybe that makes me a bad chi owner ... I just couldn't see myself spending $1000 or more on a "pet" for some papers. I also don't understand why a chi with no papers makes them any less of a chi or "unworthy"? 

At any rate, I won't breed him. I love him the way he is.


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## rcj1095 (Mar 4, 2009)

You are far from a bad chi owner, you are just that, an owner. We are not breeders. We can try to think about doing it but without years of research, I just don't think we are qualified. We certainly have a passion for them and a thirst for knowledge or we wouldn't be here. I think you made the right choice. Bailey will be much happier because of it.

I also don't think any chi is "unworthy" without being papered. I just know that for some people that count on showing or breeding, that paper is required. People that spend hundreds and hundreds of dollars on their pets might just want to know that they came from where they said they came from. 

I never even sent Romeo's papers in, but I liked having them. It made me feel secure about his background. All just my two cents.


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

I was certainly never cut out to be a breeder. When I bought Piper (our French Bulldog) to show, I had to sign a contract that she was co-owned with her breeder and that she would be bred after she finished her championship and that a puppy would go back to her breeder. And I would be responsible for all costs incurred. Well, that was an expensive and heartbreaking lesson. 

After she finished her AKC championship, she had her hips, knees, spine and elbows certified by an orthopedic veterinarian, her heart checked by a cardiologist, and her eyes CERF'd by a canine opthamologist. After passing those health tests, she was bred by artificial insemination to a champion dog in another state, chosen by Piper's breeder as a good match to her. 

His semen was collected and overnighted to our vet and then she was inseminated. It was quite a process as she was at the vet every day for 2 weeks getting blood drawn for progesterone hormone tests and vaginal smears to pinpoint her ovulation and the best time to inseminate. The semen was received, thawed, checked under the microscope, and then inseminated by the vet. Interesting but expensive. The procedure, including the stud dog fee and semen plus the vet bills and insemination charges were around $1,000. Including her health testing and other costs incurred, it was well over $2,000 and if you count in what it cost to travel and put her championship on her at dog shows, you went up from there. I pretty much quit counting after that. 

Then we played a waiting game. When she was about a month along (if I remember right) she had a sonogram. It showed a thickening of the uterus, but NO puppies. That was pretty disappointing when I had invested all that time, energy, and money and then no pregnancy. 

We then waited 6 more months and at her next season she was sent to her breeder and bred with her stud dog. She was at the breeder for over a month. She wanted her pre season, during her season, and then 2 weeks after. Again, another sonogram and then an x-ray to be sure and no pregnancy after waiting on pins and needles. During this time poor Piper endured two false pregnancies. Her belly swelled, she got moody and clingy, her nipples were engorged and even produced milk! But no puppies. 

All in all, I spent a lot of time, money, energy and no puppies were ever produced from her. It caused some hard feelings between her breeder and I too and we were pretty good friends before all this stress happened. After those two failures at being bred, she was spayed. Finally we could relax and she could just be our pet. Finally.

I learned through this whole thing that breeding is best left to the professionals. The ups and downs and roller coaster emotions were not for me. In some ways, I was glad for the failed pregnancies as Frenchies are all routinely c-sectioned and I was not looking forward to that.

I think it takes a special person to be a breeder and to do it right. There's a lot more to consider than just putting two dogs together and having puppies. Just my take from my experience. 

Brodysmom


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## Chico's Mum (Sep 9, 2008)

BaileysMommy said:


> Thank you everyone, you have helped make up our minds. He will NOT become a stud. I do not want his attitude or temperament to change, I want him to become a little less hyper (if possible) and don't want the marking to ever start. So, that sealed the deal, the boy will remain a virgin! Thank you!
> 
> I just didn't know what to think or do, I mean all these people keep saying they want to breed with him etc and I got to thinking that maybe he should. But, we got him to be a joyful companion in our family, and I don't want him to become a sex crazed monster.
> 
> ...


Hi Kim, When I first got Chico. I didn't know much too about Chi. I got him from a pet shop in Spin. In my country we don't know about the mills and so on. I didn't really thought about the neutering him or not.I didn't have a thought about it really. until people I new asked me if I wanted to breed him that they new an owner Chi female who wanted to breed her dog and that Chico well be perfect. I always said no thanks. But the real reason was I didn't want Chico living in another person house. But deep down I wanted little Chico's around me.  

In my country you don't need papers and they don't care of blood line and so on. People who breed they breed. because they well keep there puppies or give them to friends and family as a gift for free and some well sell them. and of course give the owner of the stud dog a puppy or two. What ever they decided before hand. 
The new law came out that pet shops cant sell animals. It's not because of mills or because of the animal it's because religious people thing that boys and girls are using there pets to get attention from the other sex. lol yeah i know.  I guess they were bored that day. 

But Coming to this forum I learned about mills, buying from a pet shop and BYB. 

In time I learn that neutering him well perfect my boy for later helth problems so I desided to do it. but when it got close to the surgery I had second thought about it. But I did it because I knew it was the right thing to do. But Before and after I get Chico neutered a lot of people wandering why I did it. And even tho I explain they still don't get it.  

It's along way to go for my country to learn about this but I will fight for it to happen.


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## Rosiesmum (Oct 14, 2007)

Such wonderful advice and all spot on  
So pleased that you have decided to go ahead and have him neutered, a very wise and responsible decision.

Barbara x


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## Guest (Mar 22, 2009)

I think you answered your own question pretty well, there are too many dogs now and he doesn't have papers. There's no guarantee he would pass on the qualities people like and there is a possibility that he would pass on some not-so-good qualities. Unless you're going to show or commit to improving the breed, there's no reason to breed. There's a whole lot more to breeding the way it should be done than just letting two dogs get together and have puppies. I hope you go ahead with the neuter and just enjoy your unique little guy for many years.


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## Yoshismom (Jul 6, 2005)

What color is Bailey's nose and eyes? You say even show breeder's said it was rare? Where are you located? States or UK? I was just wondering as he looks to be chocolate nosed and I know that isnt rare in the states, in fact both of my boys have chocolate noses and Yoshi has green eyes and chibi has brown eyes


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## * Bailey & Kahlua's Mom * (Nov 10, 2008)

We are in the states, in Michigan. Bailey has a pink nose and amber eyes. Yeah, a couple breeders said that there are things about Bailey that are rare and wanted.

I had 2 more offers today while at my godsons birthday party. The one woman (his grandma) has a chi-poodle who is in heat currently and she actually got MAD at me because I refused to let her mate with him. She told me I was being SELFISH!!!! 

But hubby and I agree that its for the best he remains a virgin. Only his stuffed animals will get the ... ol' hump. lol


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## TLI (Sep 3, 2008)

I have two red fawn babies with the pink/choco noses and amber colored eyes like your little one. It is less common, but I wouldn't say rare. As for breeding, even if looking aside from not having papers, it is a very big responsibility and can be costly. There is testing that needs to be done on both parents before even considering it. You can breed 2 dogs from championship lines, and still only get pet quality pups. A lot goes into the whole thing. And as already mentioned, breeding should only be done for the betterment of the breed, and the parents should be papered. I think you'll be happy with your choice not too.

No one should get mad at you for not wanting to breed, and you are not being selfish in any sense of the imagination.


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## bniles4 (Aug 4, 2008)

I thought the same thing right before Sophie got fixed. People LOVE her coloring and her eyes. But the truth is, some where out there, is another chihuahua that looks just like him. his coloring will never "end" you know? I feel like, there are too many puppies out there in shelters and some that have to be put to sleep because they dont have homes. IMO just go ahead and have him fixed. it will be okay and he will heal fast! follow your heart!


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## I<3Gizmo (Feb 12, 2009)

I was thinking about breeding my pom Evian b/c of her beautiful markings and her gorgeous eyes, but I decided not to. I just figured it was for the best and I really am tired of dealing with the "mess" of what she goes through with each heat.


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## SillySally (Jan 2, 2009)

His nose color is concidered as Liver color LOL I am not sure why all these people demand and get mad at you for not wanting to stud him and by the way he is too young to stud out anyways right now, he wouldn't even know what to do. I would just treasure him as a pet and he will be a better pet neutered.


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## Harley Ridin Chopper (Nov 8, 2007)

Brodysmom said:


> I think there are VERY few people who are qualified and should be breeding. Since I have been in the dog show world, I'm a firm believer in showing dogs to their championship before breeding. I know, that's a minority. But I believe the only people who should really be breeding are those who are in it to BETTER and improve the breed.
> 
> And no... there's no way to get papers if he doesn't have them.
> Brodysmom


I agree there are very few people qualified for breeding. Breeding takes a lot of time, dedication and hard work. I, however, disagree that only show dogs should be bred. There are lots of excellent representations of chihuahuas, or any other breed for that matter, that are not in show homes, and don't believe in limiting only show people to breeding. I personally would breed AKC and only to better the breed but have no interest in being in the show ring at this time and most likely never. I do believe people need to be educated and breed for the right reasons not because "my dog is cute". 

Breeding shows dogs does not mean the puppies come out any better looking than breeding two standard dogs that have never been shown. Most pups don't even show genuine promise until they are at least six months of age. Any gene can decide to surface from the gene pool at any given moment...I have seen some pups out there championed sired and never would have guess it just by looking at them as they where so far off standard it wasn't even funny and I have seen hobby breeders dogs (obviously good quality but not shown) throw pups with great potential. 

I love Bailey, he is one of my faves on here. I love how his personality pops in pictures and his coloring is gorgeous but I too do not believe in breeding unregistered dogs...regardless how perfect they are. Also the marking will become worse, his behavior will seriously change once he hits maturity and starts picking up those scents of females in heat. He will have one thing on his mind...pretty much like any other man LOL. 

And just to clarify there are ways to registered an unregistered dog...just with CKC not AKC. 

Obviously we all have difference of opinion but please strongly consider all outcomes of breeding. People are always in line for one "just like that" but things is life change, people change their minds when actually confronted with the opportunity for "one just like that".

Glad to see that you chose to neuter him, I think you will be much happier with his personality neutered than intact.


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

_And no... there's no way to get papers if he doesn't have them. _

I forgot about CKC and the other registries. Guess I had tunnel vision thinking only about AKC. I read somewhere that you can put papers on any dog if you send CKC a couple pictures and a statement saying what breed they are, along with their fee. Thanks for reminding me about that. Not sure what the point would be, but I guess some people want the "papers"!

I too have seen some sub-standard pups coming from generations of champion dogs and some randomly bred Chi's that are pretty close to the standard. The dog show game is full of politics. That's one reason I got out of it years ago.

Brodysmom


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## Harley Ridin Chopper (Nov 8, 2007)

Brodysmom said:


> _I forgot about CKC and the other registries. Guess I had tunnel vision thinking only about AKC. I read somewhere that you can put papers on any dog if you send CKC a couple pictures and a statement saying what breed they are, along with their fee. Thanks for reminding me about that. Not sure what the point would be, but I guess some people want the "papers"!Brodysmom_


_


Yep...all you have to do is send in one face shot and two profile shots, one of each side at the age of 6 months and you can get CKC papers..Sometimes I wonder how they can do this as I have seen pups that are mixed and they don't even look it. I know someone for example that has a yorkie/chi mix, 3/4and 1/4 respectively and people that were not really familiar with yorkie standards, me being one of them, would have never know he was mixed with a chihuahua._


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## rcj1095 (Mar 4, 2009)

That seems wrong. When I bought my first puppy, I read a book first. That's it. I didn't know a shred of what I know today. Sometimes it takes having one to fall totally in love and start the "true" research. So anyone could have charged me anything and handed me that paper and I wouldn't have known any better. What a shame for you "true" breeders that spend your love, time and money. Tsk. Tsk.


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## * Bailey & Kahlua's Mom * (Nov 10, 2008)

I hope I've not upset anyone with this thread, I was really only trying to get some opinions. I really don't want Bailey to change, so breeding him is out of the question now. We got him to be a quality member of the family, never intended on breeding him. 

But when people start hounding you about breeding, saying he is "unique", "good quality" and it would be a "horrible shame" if we don't breed him ... it started making us question if we were doing something wrong by getting him neutered. Not to mention when people ask if we are planning to breed him (not the same people that want to breed with him) and we tell them he is going to be neutered at 6 months, they look horrified, like we are monsters!!! It doesn't help the already doubtful feelings we had.

The fact that my godsons grandma got MAD, actually MAD at me yesterday because I kept telling her no, really got to me. After she started in on me about being "selfish" and "uneducated as a dog owner" because I wanted him neutered really upset me, then of course her son and his wife started in on me about how its cruel to have any dog fixed and how would I like it if I "got fixed" which was devastating to hear them say, being they already know I can't have kids etc. I shouldn't have to take this kind of crap because I made a decision about MY DOG. It was a very hard day, but I stood firm, he is still going in on Friday. 

I am still fuming and completely hurt and bothered about her actions yesterday. She turned a beautiful, fun filled day into a nightmare. On the drive home I was actually in tears.


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## Harley Ridin Chopper (Nov 8, 2007)

BaileysMommy said:


> I hope I've not upset anyone with this thread, I was really only trying to get some opinions. I really don't want Bailey to change, so breeding him is out of the question now. We got him to be a quality member of the family, never intended on breeding him.
> 
> But when people start hounding you about breeding, saying he is "unique", "good quality" and it would be a "horrible shame" if we don't breed him ... it started making us question if we were doing something wrong by getting him neutered. Not to mention when people ask if we are planning to breed him (not the same people that want to breed with him) and we tell them he is going to be neutered at 6 months, they look horrified, like we are monsters!!! It doesn't help the already doubtful feelings we had.
> 
> ...



Awwww, I am sorry that you were jumped all over by them, no offense but obviously they are the uneducated ones in not understanding the benefits of spaying and neutering, outside of unwanted puppies, there are things such as cancer that increase when a pet is not fixed so actually it is healthier for them.


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## ~*Jessie*~ (Aug 8, 2007)

Traci, I just wanted to add that I agree with everything you said. I don't think that a breeder has to show their dogs in order to be considered a good breeder. I think as long as you're breeding to breed standard (bettering the breed), breeding dogs with AKC registration, and putting love and care into your litters that you're a good breeder. I think people get too wrapped up on the whole showing thing.


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## Rosiesmum (Oct 14, 2007)

BaileysMommy;472838The fact that my godsons grandma got MAD said:


> MY DOG[/U]. It was a very hard day, but I stood firm, he is still going in on Friday.
> (


Good for you, I sincerely wish there were more responsible Chihuahua owners like you around. Too many can only think about breeding from their pets for money 

Personally I'd suggest the people you mention take a trip to their nearest dog pound and see for themselves the unwanted dogs waiting on death row. 
If there was ever a sight to support the neutering of companion dogs, this must surely be it 

Big hugs to you and your lovely Bailey :sunny:
Barbara x


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## rcj1095 (Mar 4, 2009)

Kim I can only speak for myself but you didn't upset me one bit. We are here to learn from each other. Not judge each other or think that our way is the only way, but to bounce ideas off each other and gain information. I've learned multitudes since I've been here. Bailey is gorgeous and I think he's rare looking and his personality jumps through the screen. I don't blame you one bit for considering wanting to breed him. As I said, some are so darn special we want to clone them. I feel sorry for that lady that had the nerve to make you feel bad. She is, quite obviously, limited in her knowledge and impressed that upon you. She can find a stud dog for hers if that's what she really wants. I don't think you'll be sorry with your decision and remember, it's "your" decision. People sometimes cross the line with their opinions (myself included) and forget what's really good for the other person. Bailey will be so much happier and so will you. You are a great chi mommy!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## * Bailey & Kahlua's Mom * (Nov 10, 2008)

Thanks everyone!


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## LittleHead (May 20, 2004)

*hug*
I know how you feel Kim. I remember a couple of years ago, one of aunts told me that I should breed Britney and that she needs to know what it's like to be a mom and all kinds of other crap. But, I had a situation when I was very young (didn't even know the word Responsible existed) where I had a female dog that got pregnant and I lost her and her pups in one night. After that, when I got Britney, it was already sort of 'common sense' that she was NOT going to have puppies, no matter what anyone told me. 

I support your decision to neuter Bailey.


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

There's more to breeding than just putting two dogs together and letting nature "take it's course" anyway. Having gone through the artificial insemination route with my Frenchie years ago, I learned that many of the stud dogs of that breed get so used to doing it 'into a baggie' that they couldn't mount a female if their lives depended on it. That really grossed me out!! 

Piper's breeder had to do all kinds of "gross" things to her stud dogs to get them used to being handled down there so they could do their duty. Even as little puppies. The whole thing pretty much disgusted me!!

MANY dogs out there that haven't lived the "stud" lifestyle and are family pets aren't able to perform adequately without help. I would never want to assist with that. (I bet you wouldn't either!) LOL!

Here's a medical quality **warning GRAPHIC** page on canine artificial insemination and the handling of the stud dog ....

http://arbl.cvmbs.colostate.edu/hbooks/pathphys/reprod/semeneval/dog.html


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## Tora-Oni (Sep 13, 2008)

BaileysMommy said:


> We are in the states, in Michigan. Bailey has a pink nose and amber eyes. Yeah, a couple breeders said that there are things about Bailey that are rare and wanted.
> 
> I had 2 more offers today while at my godsons birthday party. The one woman (his grandma) has a chi-poodle who is in heat currently and she actually got MAD at me because I refused to let her mate with him. She told me I was being SELFISH!!!!
> 
> But hubby and I agree that its for the best he remains a virgin. Only his stuffed animals will get the ... ol' hump. lol


So rude of her to expect others to share out their babies like their property! Oi, I don't know about what is rare in chihuahua's, and I know you probably consider Bailey one of a kind because you could never replicate another Bailey. So even though sometimes I don't really give a whiff about papers as long as I know that I'm getting a healthy and good tempered dog I think that is what counts. Though I volunteer at several different shelters and to be honest their are so many unique and beautiful mixes and even purebred dogs that come through and I just feel very sad because I know some one must have not been careful with their dog or even sold one to someone who wasn't right for the dog and so that is what scares most people when selling or finding a new home for their babies, or even their adults. We just got Chi, poodle/dachsund mix spayed, she is pretty and everyone we run into seems to like her and some people want to know what she is or where we got her. She is from a re-home add, and if someone didn't adopt her she may have ended up in a shelter.


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## * Bailey & Kahlua's Mom * (Nov 10, 2008)

OMG those pics were disgusting.... I can not see myself doing that to him... or letting anyone else for that matter! YUCK!!!!


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## Rosiesmum (Oct 14, 2007)

BaileysMommy said:


> OMG those pics were disgusting.... I can not see myself doing that to him... or letting anyone else for that matter! YUCK!!!!


I couldn't bring myself to look!!!
Not sure if imagining is worse though 

I think I shall just take your word for it! 

Barbara x


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## Brodysmom (Jan 8, 2009)

BaileysMommy said:


> OMG those pics were disgusting.... I can not see myself doing that to him... or letting anyone else for that matter! YUCK!!!!


I know. UGH. Stud dog management is not something I'd want to be involved in at all. Those people that are approaching you asking you to pimp out your Bailey (LOL!) don't know what they are asking. HA.

Brodysmom


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## Harley Ridin Chopper (Nov 8, 2007)

~*Jessie*~ said:


> Traci, I just wanted to add that I agree with everything you said. I don't think that a breeder has to show their dogs in order to be considered a good breeder. I think as long as you're breeding to breed standard (bettering the breed), breeding dogs with AKC registration, and putting love and care into your litters that you're a good breeder. I think people get too wrapped up on the whole showing thing.


Thanks Jessie


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## pinkglitterybunny (Jul 26, 2008)

Baileys mom, as your name says, you are Baileys mom! he is your little boy lol even if you wanted to stud him i dont think you could bring yourself to do that he is your little spoiled baby haha, hes so cute, even when he took an interest in his *ehem* man hood, you were sad he was growing up...hehe

so i think you made an exellent desision to keep him as your baby  xxx im sorry breeders hounded you about him, thats awful xx


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## Vicki (Mar 4, 2009)

Bless your heart for bringing this up....I think it is something that all us"non-breeders"think about at least once ..especially when we have so many people wanting you to stop so they can drool over out babies.
The more I learn about my chi the more I love the breeder I got her from. Before she said "yes " to the sale ...she spent time on the phone and e-mail with me...telling me about the breed...about what she needs in terms of food,vaccines,care,warmth,love etc. Sheila sent me so many links to read through to educate myself and to be able to decide if she would be ok with us.You see, Arabella is a tiny chi(Sheila educated me about the terms "teacup" , " mini" and such)She made sure that our house was safe,that Arabella would be safe, that we had no small children etc.
I think what I am getting at is....breeders...good breeders.. are a special breed themselves.If you believe in preserving the chi breed,then leave it to the breeders. We , as "owners" get the pleasure of getting to enjoy our babies.
I do carry business cards with Sheila's number on it.I explain to the person that chis so not come in "teacup"etc and that because she is so small that a chi of her size is not for every one.And that there is no guarantee that another one as small as her will be born.I am thinking about doing up a flier to carry and give away telling about the breed .
Sorry this is so long, but I really think you are doing the right thing getting him done. Everyone wants a cute little chi but alot of them back down when the price comes into it and the reality of taking care of it.


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## martini0904 (Oct 14, 2008)

OMG those pics were gross! I wasn't expecting THAT, that's for sure, lol! I have had poeple ask me about breeding Martini. She is a rescue and I wasn't sure at first whather she had been spayed. (Vet couldn't really see a scar) but after having her for a while and no heat, I am pretty sure she is spayed. She is never near any un-neutered male dogs.
I always told people no, I would not breed her and when they asked why, I would list all the complications. Sometimes small dogs need C-sections or artificial insemination. Then, her personality would change also. And what if anything happened to her while she was giving birth? I would never forgive myself! There is just no way I would ever take a risk like that with my baby girl. I love her too much. If I want another "just like her" I will talk to a breeder or go to a chi rescure. There is definately no such thing as a chihuahua shortage! Lol.


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## Rosiesmum (Oct 14, 2007)

martini0904 said:


> Sometimes small dogs need C-sections or artificial insemination. Then, her personality would change also. And what if anything happened to her while she was giving birth? I would never forgive myself! There is just no way I would ever take a risk like that with my baby girl. I love her too much. If I want another "just like her" I will talk to a breeder or go to a chi rescure. There is definately no such thing as a chihuahua shortage! Lol.



I agree with you. I feel the breeding of Chihuahuas should be left in the safe hands of breeders who are committed to the breed and know what they are doing. I see and hear of too many people who just want to breed for money. It saddens me and I am sure many others. 

At one time in the UK it really was difficult to find a Chi puppy, but as you say, there is no shortage now, certainly not here.

Martini is rather grgeous by the way! 

Barbara x


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## Radar_Love (Dec 19, 2007)

I've had so many stud requests for my boys. I too have heard that Radar's chocolate and tan coloring is so rare, and that I should have been breeding him all along. But, like I try to tell everyone, he came from a bad breeder, and he's not to the standard. We bought his as a pet only, not a breeder. 

Then once people caught wind of Rebel, the stud requests starting rollin' in again. I had people everywhere telling me how he has such awesome coloring, and how unique he is. But, most people couldn't understand why I wouldn't breed him. But, he came from "okay" lines, and he's over the standard for Chihuahuas. 

I've had both my boys neutered, since they are strictly my pets. But, I still hear that I should have bred them, that neutering them was a waste. People really get under my skin...


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## ~*Jessie*~ (Aug 8, 2007)

Radar_Love said:


> I've had so many stud requests for my boys. I too have heard that Radar's chocolate and tan coloring is so rare, and that I should have been breeding him all along. But, like I try to tell everyone, he came from a bad breeder, and he's not to the standard. We bought his as a pet only, not a breeder.
> 
> Then once people caught wind of Rebel, the stud requests starting rollin' in again. I had people everywhere telling me how he has such awesome coloring, and how unique he is. But, most people couldn't understand why I wouldn't breed him. But, he came from "okay" lines, and he's over the standard for Chihuahuas.
> 
> I've had both my boys neutered, since they are strictly my pets. But, I still hear that I should have bred them, that neutering them was a waste. People really get under my skin...


Even though my girls are spayed, we still get "offers" as well. Ian and I were walking them a couple of days ago when we ran into a woman with a chocolate chi. The first thing she said was "are they spayed?! I want to find my boy a girlfriend!" 

Then she asked us WHY they were spayed 

As Tucker gets older, I'm sure that requests will come pouring in for us to stud him.

We'll probably start conformation classes this May, and if all goes well then I'll debate adding him to the gene pool. lol. But he's our pet first and foremost.


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## Radar_Love (Dec 19, 2007)

Right Jessie. Tucker is gonna be a great representative of the breed! I don't understand people anymore. They're too concerned with the cuteness of puppies, rather than thinking of the standard and bettering the breed itself.


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## ~*Jessie*~ (Aug 8, 2007)

Radar_Love said:


> Right Jessie. Tucker is gonna be a great representative of the breed! I don't understand people anymore. They're too concerned with the cuteness of puppies, rather than thinking of the standard and bettering the breed itself.


I completely agree. It's hard to look at the big picture of pet overpopulation and truly answer the question of why one should be breeding. Most dogs are cute, and there are so many with good personalities... all of these qualities can be found in dogs already in shelters. 

I don't care if you show your dogs as long as you're breeding to breed standard and to better the breed. 

Thanks for the compliments on Tucker... I can't wait to see how he ends up as an adult.


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## Radar_Love (Dec 19, 2007)

I agree....there's already so many breeders that are so into the money that they don't even think about the breed itself. It's so sad. In my area, there's alot of people who breed just to breed, and to get the profit from the puppies. Its so hard to find a good breeder in my area. So, we decided to get another Chi, we looked away from the area. Luckily, Jess had Rebel, and we drove all the way to PA to get the little guy.


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