# What vaccines for my shelter rescue Jax he was current when I adopted last January he



## rosevillegirl (Apr 8, 2016)

Kind of scared as he is so very sensitive to everything..


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## Ari1405 (Apr 18, 2017)

What vaccines does he need?
The vet would know exactly what he needs. 
Did they give you paper work on what he was updated on maybe it says probably what vaccines. 
Sensitive with other people? 
If need be they can muzzle him if he tries to bite of fear or something along those lines. One of my dogs have to be muzzled.


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## Huly (Mar 5, 2012)

Titer test instead of Distemper Parvo etc, then give Rabies if he needs it and it is state mandated.


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## rosevillegirl (Apr 8, 2016)

Ari1405 said:


> What vaccines does he need?
> The vet would know exactly what he needs.
> Did they give you paper work on what he was updated on maybe it says probably what vaccines.
> Sensitive with other people?
> If need be they can muzzle him if he tries to bite of fear or something along those lines. One of my dogs have to be muzzled.




Not to people but just about everything, gets very upset I have learned a lot of people do not vaccinate I have also stopped heartworm pills as he was very sensitive to that also..


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## Huly (Mar 5, 2012)

Never give more than one thing at a time wait 4 weeks in between to look for any adverse affects.


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## MelodyoftheForest (Sep 11, 2015)

Titer testing is not always a good indicator of protection. See this for more info: Antibody Titer Testing as a Guide for Vaccination in Dogs and Cats | The SkeptVet

How old was Jax when you adopted him? If he was over a year old, most places I know of don't revaccinate for 3 years. My state requires rabies every 3 years (with a vaccine labeled as 3-year), and other things can be more flexible. Distemper/Parvo is important. The author of the link above recommends every 5 years once the dog is an adult. If Jax goes to a groomer, daycare, kennel, etc. they may have their own requirements. If had had a bad reaction with vaccines in the shelter, I would assume they would note that. I wouldn't worry about keeping him on a legal and reasonable vaccine schedule. People who don't vaccinate at all, ever, simply do not care about science and are buying into superstition.


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## Huly (Mar 5, 2012)

I totally disagree Melody. People who over vaccinate cause more harm to their dogs. Our titers have been spot on. So.e years they get another sometimes they are good. We have never had an issue. The issue we have is BG is allergic to the Rabies vaccine. She will be up for a medical exemption next year and after watching her get worse when they denied her exemption last year I don't care if I break the law her life and health is more important and I refuse to give her another rabies.


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## susan davis (Mar 25, 2011)

My vet refused to give my 11 year old Zarita a rabies vaccine. She said it would be 'too stressful for her heart'. She is an indoor dog, so that helped in her decision. I have not given her the parvo/distemper vaccine either. She had the vaccine boosters until she was 9 years old. I remember when I had a dog when I was 12 he was given the booster at one year, and he was done for life. Rabies of course was every year back then. (long time ago!)


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## Ari1405 (Apr 18, 2017)

rosevillegirl said:


> Not to people but just about everything, gets very upset I have learned a lot of people do not vaccinate I have also stopped heartworm pills as he was very sensitive to that also..
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Oh, I have personally also stopped vaccinating my 4 dogs. The longest dog to continue them was probably Buddy Bear and Sunshine. But Jr and Jojo was no older than like 2 years old (maybe even 1 and a half) 
My dogs still go outside but it's literally just the backyard. Occasionally the front yard and walking a couple houses to a relatives (which I get a bit worried since dogs come in our front yard and many dogs walk the neighborhood my dogs haven't gotten 'sick' so far) 
I also once gave Buddy Bear some kind of medicine (I think it was de-wormer, wasn't from the vet just from the store, maybe why it didn't go well) within seconds he just laid down and completely was out. That was super scary. Minutes later he got up like nothing. Never went to the vet for it (I probably should have but I didn't) So I'm very scared to do de-wormer or even something like heartworm pills for any of my dogs. But if it ever becomes an issue I would seriously reconsider the medication.


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## MelodyoftheForest (Sep 11, 2015)

Huly said:


> I totally disagree Melody. People who over vaccinate cause more harm to their dogs. Our titers have been spot on. So.e years they get another sometimes they are good. We have never had an issue. The issue we have is BG is allergic to the Rabies vaccine. She will be up for a medical exemption next year and after watching her get worse when they denied her exemption last year I don't care if I break the law her life and health is more important and I refuse to give her another rabies.


If a dog has had a reaction or is allergic, I absolutely agree they should not have that vaccine again. That is what medical exemptions are for, and if there is not one in the law, I would still not vaccinate.

As the article explains, we can't know that the antibodies we titer for are a good indicator of how much protection the dog actually has at that moment. I am not suggesting over-vaccinating, just following current science. Of course, our definitions of over-vaccinating could be very different! If you search the SkeptVet site, there are other articles about vaccines and some of the harm some think they cause.


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## MMS (Aug 2, 2012)

As a possible median here :coolwink: if you take your dog out in public (big box store, dog park, anywhere dogs congregate) before your vet appointment, you will activate the antibodies your dog has and get more accurate results for your titre tests. It is more common for a dog to test negative for antibodies that they do have, just haven't been activated recently, and end up over vaxxing, than for the other way around. 

That being said, I do one set of puppy shots around 16 weeks, and then rabies every 3-5 years (depending if I remember; We spend a lot of time in nature, so that one I will cede to). But the others we don't have a need for, or they "generally last the lifetime," so I don't really worry about.

It's really all in what you're comfortable with for your dog. Do you research on each of them, and decide which you will need for your lifestyle.


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## MelodyoftheForest (Sep 11, 2015)

MMS said:


> As a possible median here :coolwink: if you take your dog out in public (big box store, dog park, anywhere dogs congregate) before your vet appointment, you will activate the antibodies your dog has and get more accurate results for your titre tests. It is more common for a dog to test negative for antibodies that they do have, just haven't been activated recently, and end up over vaxxing, than for the other way around.
> 
> That being said, I do one set of puppy shots around 16 weeks, and then rabies every 3-5 years (depending if I remember; We spend a lot of time in nature, so that one I will cede to). But the others we don't have a need for, or they "generally last the lifetime," so I don't really worry about.
> 
> It's really all in what you're comfortable with for your dog. Do you research on each of them, and decide which you will need for your lifestyle.


Ok, but if you purposely expose your dog to diseases, you risk the dog contracting the disease you are trying to protect against. As far as I know there haven't been any challenge studies in dogs longer than about 7 years. Probably is not really enough for me to risk my dog's life rather than take an extremely small risk once every 3-5 years. Not all vaccines have possible lifetime effectiveness. I would love to see the studies you looked at while making your decisions.

Either way, OP has not come back, so this is probably a relatively futile conversation, as interesting as it is!


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## Huly (Mar 5, 2012)

I find titers very accurate. They are even used by the CDC for Rabies in humans. 

https://www.cdc.gov/rabies/specific_groups/doctors/serology.html

I am very comfortable with my results and I will not give a vaccine (other than mandated Rabies) if they titer immune. 

Why take the risk? Remember my cat caught a disease from a vaccine.


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## MMS (Aug 2, 2012)

MelodyoftheForest said:


> Ok, but if you purposely expose your dog to diseases, you risk the dog contracting the disease you are trying to protect against. As far as I know there haven't been any challenge studies in dogs longer than about 7 years. Probably is not really enough for me to risk my dog's life rather than take an extremely small risk once every 3-5 years. Not all vaccines have possible lifetime effectiveness. I would love to see the studies you looked at while making your decisions.
> 
> Either way, OP has not come back, so this is probably a relatively futile conversation, as interesting as it is!


Do you not ever take your dog outside? And I'm assuming you sterilize yourself before you walk into your home as well? How do you think vaccines work, exactly? 
You are always exposing your dog and yourself to disease. Exposure is what creates a healthy immune system to begin with. It's when you DON'T regularly expose your immune system to the diseases they have been vaccinated for that the body starts to shelve antibodies, assuming they are no longer needed. Biology 101. It's not like you wake up one day and your body says "Oh, it's been 3 years since I got that shot, guess I don't have to make these antibodies anymore!" 

I didn't say that all vax have possible lifetime effectiveness, but the big ones do (including rabies, which I have already said I keep up with, because of possible exposure; and I don't have need for the ones that don't, like bordatella). And it's common knowledge that you shouldn't vaccinate senior dogs, because the risk of complication is increased immensely - so 7 years is plenty for most dogs. Vets who keep their practices up to date with research will tell you this. 

If you want to vaccinate your dog every 3-5 years, by all means do so! If you don't let your dog ever be where other dogs have been, and they're not naturally building an immunity, sure (but wait, then do you really need to vaccinate at all if you're keeping your pup in a bubble? :dontknow: ) It's just not necessary for most dogs. 

I'm all for RESPONSIBLE vaccination - just like RESPONSIBLE spay/neuter... it's not a "one size fits all" deal.


(ETA: I'm not saying that you specifically are keeping your dog in a bubble... but I know some crazy people who won't let their dogs touch grass "because some other dog could have peed there..." Also, that's a semi-serious question that I don't know the answer to - science is tricky sometimes)


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## MelodyoftheForest (Sep 11, 2015)

I'm sorry I wasn't clear. Sometimes what is in my head doesn't all get down in an understandable way when I type. I don't mean never expose a dog to other dogs, but if you are doing titers at a time when the dog's immunity from the last vaccine could be waning, that is a big risk. Even with the assumption that titers are accurate indicators of a dog's immunity to a disease, doing heavier-than-normal exposure right before titer testing sounds risky to me. As Huly mentioned, sometimes the titers indicate a vaccine should be given. If the dog's antibodies are waning and the dog is exposed to the deadly diseases we vaccinate for, it could contract one of those deadly diseases.

I know there are many people whose animals have gotten sick in one way or another after being vaccinated. That can be a horribly difficult thing to go through, and I do not minimize that at all. What a pile of anecdotes does not do, though, is give very good data. The data we have says that animals and people need a high percentage of the population to be vaccinated to prevent the spread of disease. This is because vaccines are not perfect and do not protect every animal 100%, and because some animals and people cannot be vaccinated for various medical reasons. The data also says that the risk of vaccination is vastly lower than the risk of an unvaccinated animal contracting a deadly or life-altering disease.

My point to the OP is that I don't want anyone to be overly afraid of vaccination because very occasionally something bad happens. An overwhelming amount of the time the dog will be fine. They need to talk to their vet and make a plan that makes sense for their situation, taking into account that herd immunity is vital to the safety of dogs like Huly's that can't be vaccinated.


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## Huly (Mar 5, 2012)

MelodyoftheForest said:


> I'm sorry I wasn't clear. Sometimes what is in my head doesn't all get down in an understandable way when I type. I don't mean never expose a dog to other dogs, but if you are doing titers at a time when the dog's immunity from the last vaccine could be waning, that is a big risk. Even with the assumption that titers are accurate indicators of a dog's immunity to a disease, doing heavier-than-normal exposure right before titer testing sounds risky to me. As Huly mentioned, sometimes the titers indicate a vaccine should be given. If the dog's antibodies are waning and the dog is exposed to the deadly diseases we vaccinate for, it could contract one of those deadly diseases.
> 
> I know there are many people whose animals have gotten sick in one way or another after being vaccinated. That can be a horribly difficult thing to go through, and I do not minimize that at all. What a pile of anecdotes does not do, though, is give very good data. The data we have says that animals and people need a high percentage of the population to be vaccinated to prevent the spread of disease. This is because vaccines are not perfect and do not protect every animal 100%, and because some animals and people cannot be vaccinated for various medical reasons. The data also says that the risk of vaccination is vastly lower than the risk of an unvaccinated animal contracting a deadly or life-altering disease.
> 
> My point to the OP is that I don't want anyone to be overly afraid of vaccination because very occasionally something bad happens. An overwhelming amount of the time the dog will be fine. They need to talk to their vet and make a plan that makes sense for their situation, taking into account that herd immunity is vital to the safety of dogs like Huly's that can't be vaccinated.


My Vet titers 3 months after a vaccine and yearly. If my dogs are on the low scale of immunity they receive a booster. She also titers after a vaccine to make sure they have a high immunity. Some dogs might need more and some need less. every body type is different. I am very confident with this as I am not giving vaccines blindly but also after they do receive a booster I am not walking around blindly not knowing if they have an immunity or not. 

The same goes for people in medicine. Not every drug works for every person. I am allergic to flu shot so every year I have to make the decision to receive the vaccine and get sick or take the risk and OD on vitamin C hoping I don't get sick LOL. I choose the later keep up on my vitamins try to make sure I stay as healthy as possible without catching the flu. 

I am not trying to come down on you I just want you to see the full spectrum. Titers are awesome and I am so happy with them and my furkids. I don't feel like I am playing a guessing game anymore on their immunity and that my kids are safe. I also don't want anyone to walk through what I have with my indoor only cat catching a disease from a vaccine as they gave him a vaccine while he was sick. Every time he has a flare up I feel guilty as I agreed to vaccinate him against something he could not catch being indoors.


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